Joyland - Playtech - Absolutely shocking

[stgeorge]

(Mods please merge or move this if it has been reported already - I did a search but found no reference).

As has been reported by a few sources, a player won the Beach Life jackpot at Joyland Casino for a reported $4,188,719.98. Unbeknown to the player, the casino had a progressive policy of max payout per month equal to 9K. This means it would take a ridiculous 39 years to pay.

Cut a long story short, the player settled on $2.3 million (half the prize) plus bonus which was $61,000 in VIP points at the casino after much negotiations as you will see in the links below.

There is so much wrong here that it defies belief:

1. The actual condition of payment
2. Joyland negotiated through a hotmail account (!)
3. They closed the player account after settlement
4. The jackpot is on the Playtech network. Where is the remaining $2 million? Did the Joyland owners pocket it? They must have, unless the terms comes from Playtech which I doubt because casinos like bet365 pay in full...

It is unclear to me as to whether William Hill online, the now owners of this grand establishment, is aware of this as it seems like it happened before their confusing deal..

Regardless, the whole thing stinks to high heaven and is up there with the worst I have seen in many years in this industry.

Opinions?

Reported here at Casino Meister.

http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...ssive-win.html

and here

http://www.new-online-slots.com/prog...-05-15-09.html

[KasinoKing]

4. The jackpot is on the Playtech network. Where is the remaining $2 million? Did the Jackpotjoy owners pocket it? They must have, unless the terms comes from Playtech which I doubt because casinos like bet365 pay in full...

Although this is actually very serious, it's hard not to see the funny side of this situation from Joyland's former owners point of view.

They owned a dodgy casino, ripped off a player for $2 million, then shortly afterwards sold their crap establishment to one of the (formally) most highly respected names in gambling, William Hills.

I bet these guys wake up in their mansions every morning grinning from ear to ear!

KK

[Ixian]

Thanks for the information. I have just read the thread on Casinomeister and find it extremely shocking.

I promote some Playtech casinos and will check their terms & conditions and if they have similar rules I will drop them.

Nothing but absolute theft.

[Schankwart]

This casino has been known for foul actions for years. Hearing this does honestly not surprise me.

[raphnix]

This casino has been known for foul actions for years. Hearing this does honestly not surprise me.

But with players still winning with them and playing honestly to their casino games, it would mean that they're still gaining more revenues from their scams.

Labeling them as rogue won't be enough compare with the $2 Mil winning of their player.

[stgeorge]

I have done a scan of some of the major Playtech casino's terms and conditions.

Disclaimer: It's Friday night and I am tired after a long week so I apologise in advance if I missed something. Nor URLS included below but you will find the terms below either on the casino's "Terms and Conditions" link or via their Privacy Policy.

First of all thanks to Meister who has already posted on his forum the following:
http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...tml#post298797

Doing a Google search on "The foregoing applies also to Withdrawals of progressive jackpots." came up with these:

32Vegas
Goldenpalace
WilliamHillcasino
playgate
carnavalcasino.com
eurogrand
casinotropez
zodiacbingo
majesticcomet.com
grandplaycasino.com
rubybingo.com
bettercasino

So the above list of casinos all unfortunately appear to have the stipulation in question published in their legals, iei they stipulate that progressive wins are subject to their weekly withdrawal restrictions.

I have taken the liberty of scanning through a few of the other programs. I urge the Aff Managers to post if I am wrong or missed something.

In most cases no specific reference is made to the withdrawal of progressive wins (although as you will see, most of the casinos actually have weekly and / or monthly restrictions on what you are allowed to withdraw). Unfortunately most refer to a restriction, but do not make specific reference to progressives. In this case we can assume, for now, that progressives are included in the restrictions. (Unless of course the programs come forward and tell us differently. I would expect that some of the programs who have had big jackpot winners have paid them in full only becuase this is the first scandal of this nature involving a Playtech that I am aware of...?)

Affclub: Entercasino, Casino Las Vegas, Casino King, Swiss, Magic Box, Carnival, Club Dice
6.5.3 You are aware of and agree that the maximum amount that a Player can cash-out is $10,000 USD (or the equivalent amount in EURO or GBP currency) per month. All amounts larger than $10,000 will be paid in terms until the full withdrawal amount is reached. This condition also applies to winnings of progressive jackpots. Withdrawals depend on verification of all required documents as set in clause 9.4.

Focal: Omni Casino
6.5.3 You are aware of and agree that the maximum amount that a Player can cash-out is $10,000 USD (or the equivalent amount in EURO or GBP currency) per month. All amounts larger than $10,000 will be paid in terms until the full withdrawal amount is reached. This condition also applies to winnings of progressive jackpots. Withdrawals depend on verification of all required documents as set in clause 9.4..

Mansion
http://www.mansioncasino.com/withdra...icy/index.html
The maximum withdrawal limits are $30,000 per calendar month. - no mention of progressives

Casino.com
Superior Suite, Red Carper Room and Millionaire Club levels can withdraw over $30,000 per month.
Player, Lobby, Prestige Parlour, Champagne Bar, Honour Chamber and Elite Lounge are capped at withdrawals of up to $30,000 per month.
No mention of progressives

Blasters: onlinecasino.com, flamingoclub, 24ktgold, goldenpalacecasino, grandonlinecasino.com
6.5.3 You are aware of and agree that the maximum amount that a Player can be paid-out is $8000 per week. - no mention of progressives

Casino Plex
6.5.3 [You are aware of and agree that the maximum amount that a new Player can cash-out when winning $20,000 or more in casino games within a 30 day period, is $5000 per month.] no reference to progressives

Windows Casino
6.6.2 Applicable to withdrawals, a maximum of $5000 (Five Thousand US Dollars) will be sent per week, all balances will be sent in increments of $5000 the following week(s). - no mention of progressives

Casino Fortune (did not check their sister casinos but assume they are the same)
NB: You are aware of and agree that the maximum amount that a Player can cash-out when winning $20,000 or more in casino games within a 30 day period, is $5000 per month .

African Palace, Indio Casino
17. The maximum amount that a new player playing at the casino for less than twelve months can cashout when winning USD 5,000, EUR 5000, or R10,000 or more within a 30 day period from all of First Grand Gaming N.V. Casinos, is USD 3000, EUR 3000, or R5000 per month.

18. No more than USD 20,000, EUR 20,000, or R50,000 plus the total amount that you have deposited into your account in the past 30 days, can be withdrawn per month (maximum of USD 20,000, EUR 20,000, or R50,000 in winnings can be withdrawn per month for players registered at the casino for more than twelve months).

These casinos are either 100% okay as far as restrictions are concerned or I could not find any reference to restrictions on their websites. Please correct if I am wrong:
Circus seems to be OK
Play United seems ok
Giant Vegas, Royal Dice - No specific restrictions other than their normal bonus restrictions

[AmCan]

I'm not happy with these restrictions

BUT

If you play Megabucks (the progressive shared by land based casinos in the US) and you win. you will be paid with 26 equal payments over 25 years. How many people here have played Megabucks without knowing that it's an annuity.

so, while the restrictions are troubling, too low for big winners, the idea of paying out the jackpot over 10's of years is not unique to online gaming?

Finally, the value of s $4.1 million prize, paid as a 30 year annuity would be about $2-$2.4 million dollars. So the payout they arranged for the player was the equivalent of the Powerball winner taking the cash prize, over the 30 year payout.

[pgaming]

Opinions?

Absolutely shocking these casino owners really need to feel what it is like on the other side. Especially Joyland crooked bunch. Well hey there is always Ecogra to complain to LMAO!

greek39

[Nodepositworld]

Well hey there is always Ecogra to complain to LMAO!

Sombody woke up on the funny side of the bed this morning lol !!

[giggles7p]

IF the player also claims this win on thier taxes, there goes another million out the window, so the player ends up with 1 million out of a 4 million jackpot.

Still nice money, but wtf! everything in life is a scam now. if you don't do your research on anything you are going to get screwed no matter what it is. look at anything you buy, win or invest in , there are always "clauses, and loop holes" protecting the other side in some way or another.

[stgeorge]

I'm not happy with these restrictions

BUT

If you play Megabucks (the progressive shared by land based casinos in the US) and you win. you will be paid with 26 equal payments over 25 years. How many people here have played Megabucks without knowing that it's an annuity.

so, while the restrictions are troubling, too low for big winners, the idea of paying out the jackpot over 10's of years is not unique to online gaming?

Finally, the value of s $4.1 million prize, paid as a 30 year annuity would be about $2-$2.4 million dollars. So the payout they arranged for the player was the equivalent of the Powerball winner taking the cash prize, over the 30 year payout.

Fair point. Bottom line is the casinos use progressives as their most powerful marketing tool, promising instant riches. The way they negotiated leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

[FurnessPoker]

I bet these guys wake up in their mansions every morning grinning from ear to ear!

KK

Actually they pay someone else to wake up and smile for them, also employ a couple of guys to go MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!