Player Database Sales

[bigbcasinos]

Aaargh cr@p

Don't shoot me for thinking that the world post UIGEA needs a new outlook with a LOAD of tolerance.

These were just MY personal thoughts and I am NOT taking sides against anybody here!

I gather people were banned at CAP for speaking out. I am sorry this happened to you guys. I live here on the GPWA and on my own small forum... I visit CAP every now and then to read what is going on in the www and the casinos. I have also bought some websites from a number of CAP members, and never once have I had cause to not pay before I even received the websites. They have always honored the deals that were made.

I very rarely read further than that though......

[Caruso]

Yuh, I suppose it's a matter of opinion.

A current issue emerged, very similar to this past incident though perpetrated by someone else. The past incident was resurrected to support the contention that database sales were at least tolerated, if not encouraged, by CAP.

That is the relevance to the present.

Beyond that, people, including me, were unaware of that past issue, and felt the urge to comment on it on its own merit, irrespective of the original purpose of using it to simply reinforce an observation of the possible tolerance of player database sales by CAP. That is why this thread appeared here (I think).

As such, either as a stand alone case or as evidence of a tendency, the issue has merit.

[bigbcasinos]

Guilty as charged of not reading everything that's out there.

Sometimes I really don't want to. I simply want the industry to fight back against that which is seriously wrong. I find the fact that citizens of the US cannot spend their hard earned (post tax) dollars on a personal pleasure simply amazing. I find the fact that enforceable legislation can be enacted by means of a midnight tryst reprehensible. All of this is really HUGE. Not because it affects me incomewise as a webmaster (my main market is NOT the USA), but the sheer principle is massive.

Viewed in this light, everythings seems so unimportant until this HUGE issue is resolved.

[igami]

Selling of private player databases is a timeless issue, it will NEVER be unimportant, NEVER! It was wrong yesterday, it is wrong today, and it will be wrong tomorrow!

When just one person feels they can openly offer for sale, such an item, we have an issue. When we start to see multiple cases of the behavior we have a problem. When that problem is permitted to occur in a visible location, we have a serious problem!

The older thread was mentioned on the iGAMI site because it is relevant to the recent, yes again recent case. I can’t speak for any of the other posters but I can sincerely say for me personally this has absolutely nothing to do with revenge or jealousy and everything to do with establishing a history of incidences and simply put to distinguish between right and wrong.

Quite frankly, I personally think it is complete nonsense to suggest that obvious unethical behaviors are being reported because people are jealous. To imply that it serves absolutely no purpose other than to redirect the focus and to discredit those who have reported the wrong doing(s). Further regarding that concept, it shouldn’t matter why something is being reported – if those items which are being reported are found to be true and unethical, the report alone should have inherent merit which in no way justifies ridicule of the reporter(s).

But hey, go ahead and shovel this dirt under the rug, redirect the focus. Sadly, that has always been common place in this sector of the industry; nothing has changed in that respect and until people start “collectively” thinking and behaving in an “openly” ethical manner nothing ever will.

[greek39]

Blocking my IP while I was thrown into the "free for all section". Don't be blind because I can view everything.

The DB issue is impotrtant and if need be I will retrieve the deleted threads. Remember "nothing can be deleted" on the net. Have fun throwing me around.

greek39

[joeyl]

Sorry Bigb, my tolerance does not stretch to the selling on of databases of players details bought from a casino.
Not from a hacker, a cracker, a spammer or Tony Blair

Yes, I have contacted my local MP to make my disgust known.

I have no one to contact about Cap, so I voted with my feet.

Frankly, I have other issues re online gaming too yes. I voice my concern ni'on daily. It's not just Lou, who I am very disappointed with in this instance.

[bigbcasinos]

Originally Posted by igami

I personally think it is complete nonsense to suggest that obvious unethical behaviors are being reported because people are jealous.

I think you got it wrong? I said that in MY opinion it was anger or revenge that possibly aided the direction the thread in question (regarding the recent database for sale) took.

By the way, you will note that I thought that it was best to let the matter be. I most certainly am not deleting this thread nor moderating the heck out of it.

Those are simply my beliefs. If you think gnawing the heck out of the old bones of the industry is going to help it grow into something more healthy, go for it. I only placed my thoughts on record. I won't step in to contradict you any more.

[bigbcasinos]

Originally Posted by joeyl

It's not just Lou, who I am very disappointed with in this instance.

I know you are principled. I have a few friends in common who speak highly of you. Personally I think you might need a little more flexibility but if you say your say and live by it, then that is indeed admirable.

I hope I haven't dissapointed you but here, I am not talking about a database of names for sale, I am talking about connecting a 2 year old thread with a current one and then going after the webmaster in the 2 year old thread. Not that it makes the webmaster any less accountable but it still seems a little like a witch hunt to me.

I am not condoning the sale of a full casino database at all. If this thread was only about the sale, then for sure it would be a different matter.

[joeyl]

Righteo Bigb.

It's either a moral crusade, or not.

I will write some facts as I have them, you can note the relevance or lack thereof.

# 2 years ago, Lou offered a 10 gig database of folks details on the Cap forum for sale.

# 2 weeks ago, Johnny come lately offered a 10 gig database of folks details on the Cap forum for sale.

[bigbcasinos]

And some wierdo has had my e-mail adress for ages and has mailed me regularly offering time stamped databases for sale. Some advertising agency I recall. I delete the mails immediately.

To be honest, once so many casinos pulled out of the USA, I personally wondered how soon it would be that someone started selling a database.

Did it say that the database for sale was UK based? If so that may be because the UK market is suddenly so much more important for some peoples survival that the databases value was suddenly huge. If it was US based, then it's because it was an asset that only had a value to the owner in the event of a sale. (morals not being discussed in this hypothesis)

By the way, this is simply theory but what is to stop a greedy staff member of a casino from taking a now unused US database and selling it off to the highest bidder. Pop off to Yahoo or Hotmail and get some anonymity and away you go. Money in the bank.

Now, I am not taking anyones side here at all. It's just that my scenario is also likely so why take only one view and then hammer it home like it was pure fact?