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  1. #1
    marko6's Avatar
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    Default Problem gambling based demand to reinstate lost winnings of 75k

    Hello,
    from October 2012 until April 2013 I was extremely lucky at the Club Gold Casino, winning a total of 110 000 Euro. In April 2013 I sent several emails to the casino, informing them that I have a gambling problem and that I want my account to be locked, until my total balance has been cashed out. I had no other choice, because the casino does have a monthly withdrawal limit of 5000 Euro.

    I finally received an email from Dino (the casino boss) saying, that my account will be locked and I will continue receiving 5000 Euro per month, until all my funds have been cashed out. In May 2013 I received a promotional email from the Club Gold Casino with the invitation to play again. My account was unlocked despite the fact, that the casino was aware of my gambling problem! I started playing again and lost the remaining 75 000 Euro of my funds, which had not been cashed out at that time.

    I kindly ask GPWA members to negotiate in this issue. The point is very simple: The casino should NOT have unlocked my account in May 2013, because Dino (the casino boss) guaranteed me by email, that my account will remain locked until all my funds have been cashed out. Therefore, I ask the casino to refund the 75 000 Euro, that I lost in May 2013 and June 2013, because the casino unlocked my account, ALTHOUGH they were aware of the fact, that I have a gambling problem.

    I wish to point out, that the casino offers several options to protect players: setting deposit limits, setting wagering limits and setting the duration of play sessions. I set all of these limits to the lowest values, but they were always removed within minutes, when I asked for it during a simple chat. This is not, how those protection tools should work. There should be at least a 7 day cooling-off period for the player, to let him reconsider his decision.

    Please help!
    marko6




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  3. #2
    -Shay- is offline Public Member
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    Contact Playtech and notify them of your complaint. Per the RGA (Remote Gambling Association) terms, you should not receive any type of promotional communication for at least six months from your opt out.

    The provision of a self-exclusion facility for any customers who wish to exclude themselves from gambling on the operator’s website. During the chosen period the customer will also be excluded fromall forms ofcommunication from the operator. The chosen period should be for a minimum of 6 months. Reasonable steps should be taken to prevent promotional material being sent to a customer during the exclusion period. Source
    When contacting them, provide them with an overview of your issue (the same thing you posted here should be sufficient for starters). Be prepared to provide proof after they have responded to your initial complaint. This should include any copies you have requesting to be banned, as well as the promotional invite.

    There is a chance that the email you received was from an affiliate, not from the actual casino (I'd bet the farm this will be claimed). However, there is no chance at all that the affiliate could have had your account unlocked. This blame falls squarely upon Club Gold Casino's shoulders.

    There is no doubt in my mind that providing the player sent an email requesting his account be locked due to problem gambling - this request should have been honoured. The player should also have the full backing of this community and providing the player sent an email request like he said - he should also have the full support of our community to help him do whatever we can to recoup this money. Let's throw the rug and broom out on this one and help him out.

    edit: The above is "step 1" in giving Playtech the opportunity to "persuade" Club Gold Casino to do the right thing. Keep this thread updated with any progress or lack thereof you get. If they do not do right by you, I'll post what I believe to be a logical step 2.
    Last edited by -Shay-; 26 August 2013 at 9:28 am.

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  5. #3
    HBKKH is offline Public Member
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    wow. GL getting that 75k back.

  6. #4
    CarmelS is offline Non-sponsor Affiliate Program
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    Club Gold Casino received a communication from the player asking for his casino account to be closed on 5 June 2013 due to gambling problems. Such instances are taken extremely seriously and uponreceipt of such a request the appropriate steps were immediately taken to close the account with immediate effect. This socially responsible procedure is applied to all accounts to also ensure player protection.


    The account closure also includes the disabling of all funding options applied to the account, along with the removal of the player’s email address details from our mailings lists.


    Club Gold normally provides the facility of self-exclusion for a minimum period of 6 months. Once the self-exclusion process has been completed for a customer, the account will remain closed with no option for reopening until the period set has expired. During the period of self-exclusion, Club Gold Casino will do all it can to prevent the customer from opening new accounts. Additionally a permanent block will be applied on our system of all the player’s registered personal details, thus preventing these details from being registered again in the future.


    To further protect the player from future temptation we also suggest to the player on how to uninstall the casino software and seek third party assistance such as Gamcare (http://www.gamcare.org.uk) and to download Gamblock (http://www.gamblock.com).

  7. #5
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    Yes, but what you state in your post does NOT match what the player experienced.

    In the above stated case the players account was re-opened in the neighborhood of 30 days.

    Marko6, Shay gave you very good avice, please keep us updated.

    Rick
    Universal4

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  9. #6
    CarmelS is offline Non-sponsor Affiliate Program
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    For the avoidance of doubt, the first time the player ever mentioned a gambling problem to the casino was on 5 June 2013. We confirm that the player’s account was closed on that date and remains closed to the present day.
    The player had made a previous request for his account to be closed on 22 October 2011 for reasons other than a gambling problem and the account was indeed closed between that date and 13 October 2012, when he asked for it to be reopened. As is standard practise, in cases where accounts are closed due to reasons not related to gambling problems, then these can be reopened at any time following the request of the player, which was the case in this instance.
    The casino holds records of all email and chat exchanges with the player, clearly showing that 5 June 2013 was the first date on which a gambling problem was mentioned by the player. We will be pleased to make our records available to GPWA.

  10. #7
    -Shay- is offline Public Member
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    Obviously both sides (to be fair) have some sort of vested interest in their timeline/story holding up.

    Carmel, I noticed that all Club Gold's credentials are bought and paid for. Does Club Gold hold an actual remote gambling licence anywhere that the player "could" reach out to on this matter?

  11. #8
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    Default Update from the player

    Quote Originally Posted by CarmelCGC View Post
    We confirm that the player’s account was closed on that date and remains closed to the present day.
    It is true, that my account is closed since June 5th. It is not true, that June 5th is the first day, when I mentioned my gaming problems. As a matter of fact, I asked Club Gold Casino in several chats between November 2012 and April 2013 to lock my account, so that I can withdraw my winnings without being able to lose them again. I hit the 1st big win at the end of October 2012 (50k win playing the "Rome & Glory" slots). At that time I was told, that if I close my account, then I cannot withdraw all of my funds, because I have to submit a new 5k withdrawal request every month while being logged in. So, I continued playing and withdrawing 5k per month. I was able to increase my balance without ever breaking one of their bonus rules. I did make additional deposits during that time. From January 2013 until April 2013 I informed the casino several times, that I wish my account to be locked with my funds to be withdrawn automatically in 5k steps every month. I also asked for an increase of that 5k limit, but that wish was turned down. Most important, I used the self-limitations offered by the casino at least 20 times: I set the monthly deposit to 1 Euro, I set the monthly wagering limit to 1 Euro, and I set the session timer to 10 minutes. Whenever I asked for the removal of those limits, it was done within a few minutes, even if the limit was a "monthly limit". I am sure that Playtech can verify, that I have set those limits at least 20 times between January 2013 and April 2013.

    Finally, I received an email from Dino (the casino boss), that he agrees to lock my account and to continue cashing out my funds. I am sure that Playtech can also verify, that my account was completely locked between April 5th and May 15th. I informed the casino, that it is my wish, that my account shall NOT be unlocked, until all of my funds have been paid. Then, I received a promotional email to play again. I asked my account to be unlocked. It was unlocked, although the casino had my wish on file, that the account shall remain locked until all funds have been paid. The rest you know: I started playing again and lost the remaining balance of 75k, which had not been cashed out at that time.

    I ask the casino to refund those 75k, because of the following two reasons:
    1) the casino unlocked my account, although it was aware of my gaming problem and of my wish to opt out until all funds have been paid.
    2) the casino removed my wagering limits, deposit limits and session timers in more than 20 instances, although I submitted those limits with the time specification "monthly".

    Meanwhile, I submitted this issue to Playtech, but I only received an automatic reply, that the person in charge is on maternity leave.

    I wish to point out, that I did enjoy playing at Club Gold Casino. They do have an unbeatable bonus program and an excellent customer service. I was a very loyal player having obeyed all of their rules. However, it is not fair play, if a casino removes wagering limits immediately and neglects his wish to opt out, as long as the player has a lot of money in his account. And then, from the day when my balance was down to zero, the casino suddenly refers to its strict policy regarding those players with gaming problems.

    Club Gold, please treat me as fair as I treated you while playing at your casino.
    marko6
    Last edited by marko6; 27 August 2013 at 2:27 pm.

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  13. #9
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    Mark, do you have proof (copy of sent email, chat logs, etc) that you requested your account closed due to problem gambling with the dates you have mentioned? Also, do you have anything of the sort in regards to the setting limits issue (copy of chat logs, emails exchanged with support, etc)?

    edit: With your above response, I have no doubt in my mind that your story is true. You will (obviously) need proof to back it up when you finally get in touch with someone who can make a difference for you.

    Second edit to ensure Carmel doesn't "miss" this important question :

    Carmel, I noticed that all Club Gold's credentials are bought and paid for. Does Club Gold hold an actual remote gambling licence anywhere that the player "could" reach out to on this matter?
    Last edited by -Shay-; 28 August 2013 at 5:14 am.

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    Default 2nd update from the player

    Shay,
    I did not make copies of the chats, that I had. I guess, that most players don't make copies of their chats. Unfortunately, I also deleted the email correspondence that I had with Club Gold Casino. After having lost all of my funds, I was so frustrated, that I wanted to remove everything, that reminds me of that bad experience. At that time I did not know about player's rights. Meanwhile, I have informed myself and learnt, that casinos need to follow certain rules, as well.

    I kindly ask Dino from the Club Gold Casino to review all the emails that I had sent to the casino and all the chats that I had with the casino. I had asked the casino to lock my account several times. I cannot recall, how often I did. Playtech might be able to prove that my account had indeed be fully locked between April 5th and May 15th. Playtech might also be able to prove that I had set MONTHLY wagering limits and deposit limits (of 1 Euro each) more than 20 times, and that those limits had always been removed by the casino without any cooling-off period. It would help, if someone can give me the email address of a Playtech employee who can assist me in this issue.

    If that is not enough evidence, I can inform the GPWA community about another unfair treatment that I encountered at the Club Gold Casino. In the video poker game "Jacks or Better" (4 hands) I hit a Royal Flush with a 20k win. Since that day I was never able to play that game again with the English version of their casino software. I always received the message that "the game is currently not available". I started several chats and sent several emails to the casino, but I was always told that the game is "under maintenance". I was told that same reason even 30 days after having hit the Royal Flush. I do not believe, that this very common game was under maintenance for more than 30 days. I also found that I was not able to play any other video poker games and any blackjack games and any other table games anymore. I was only able to play slots. Today, I assume that the casino wanted me to play slots with my funds, because slots have the worst odds among all casino games. As a matter of fact, I did find a way to play video poker again by istalling the Greek version of their casino software. For some reason, that version allowed my to play "Aces and Faces" video poker. But in the end, that did not help. Because my account had been unlocked (although I initially requested a lock until all funds have been paid), I finally lost all of my funds.

    Also very annoying were the very long delays in receiving the 5k payouts. As I stated previously, I had my first big win (50k) in October. I requested a payout in October, but my first 5k withdrawal was processed at the end of November, and I received that money in the first week of December. Regarding my February payout I even had to wait until the middle of April, until I had it completely in my bank account. The casino told me that the delays were caused by the processing banks.

    By the way, I just remember that I did send a private message to Dino through my Casinomeister account. Maybe, I can retrieve a copy of that message, but currently I have no access to that account, because I closed that account, too, due to my frustration regarding online gambling.

    All I can do now, is kindly asking Dino and Carmel again to carefully read all the correspondence that we had. Dino did send me an email from his own mail account, in which he assured me that I will keep on getting 5k per month, while my account is locked. Please, Dino, give yourself a push! I am not just contriving a story here.

    marko6

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    Please be advised that Club Gold is currently in the process of providing our email and chat records with the player to GPWA, which will prove that 5 June 2013 was the first date on which a gambling problem was mentioned by the player

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    Quote Originally Posted by CarmelCGC View Post
    Please be advised that Club Gold is currently in the process of providing our email and chat records with the player to GPWA, which will prove that 5 June 2013 was the first date on which a gambling problem was mentioned by the player
    I would have bet the farm that this question was going to be ignored...

    Quote Originally Posted by -Shay- View Post
    THIRD POSTING to ensure Carmel doesn't "miss" this important question :

    Carmel, I noticed that all Club Gold's credentials are bought and paid for. DOES CLUB GOLD CASINO HOLD AN ACTUAL REMOTE GAMBLING LICENCE ANYWHERE THAT THE PLAYER COULD REACH OUT TO ON THIS MATTER?

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    Mark,

    I would definitely pursue the Playtech route to get proof of what you're saying, as you will need it.

    In the interim, my hope is that Carmel quits ignoring my questions and shares if/where Club Gold Casino is licenced & regulated so that you can also pursue that angle as well.

    Worth noting, this is not the first time that Carmel has ignored my highly relevant questions in a problem thread regarding Club Gold Casino.

  19. #14
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    Marko6,

    If in fact you sent a private message at Meister's forum and you have it set to keep a copy in the sent, it should be there.

    Like Shay suggested, you are likely to need to go the route of Playtech, since you have very little if any evidence to back your claims. (I am not disputing either side's claim, but without the evidence in front of me, it would speculation on my part) If in fact that Playtech backs your claim then that would be evidence, but as Carmel stated, they will be providing chat logs and emails from their side.

    Rick
    Universal4

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    Default 3rd update from the player

    I would like GPWA to forward the email and chat records to my email address. I would like to confirm myself, whether they contain Dino's personal replies regarding my request to opt out, and whether they contain his guarantee that my monthly 5k withdrawals will continue from a locked casino account.

    I believe that a reputable company like Playtech will have kept log files of my monthly wagering and deposit limits. Only Playtech is independent in this issue and can verify, whether I have set monthly wagering limits of 1 Euro or not. I swear that I have set those limits at least 20 times between January 2013 and April 2013, and that the casino has removed those limits within minutes without applying any cool-off period. As far as I know now, that is not the right behaviour towards a player who requested his account to be locked.

    I do need help finding an appropriate person at Playtech, who can help. I sent a request to Playtech, but until now I only received an automatic reply from an employee saying that she is "on maternity leave".

    Regards
    marko6

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  22. #16
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    whether I have set monthly wagering limits of 1 Euro or not. I swear that I have set those limits at least 20 times between January 2013 and April 2013, and that the casino has removed those limits within minutes without applying any cool-off period. As far as I know now, that is not the right behaviour towards a player who requested his account to be locked
    I agree with this part of the statement, that if in fact they unlocked your account AFTER you asked to self-exclude, they they were wrong to do so.

    I disagree with the statement about Playtech being the only independent party in the matter and in fact a few of us are and have helped many over the years.

    Rick
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    Default 4th update by the player

    Rick,
    I am very happy indeed, if you or someone else at GPWA can help in this issue. That is why I posted it here. I even agree to have this thread completely removed, if Club Gold Casino pays an appropriate refund.

    But regarding proofs I believe, that Playtech is the only party that can unearth the truth. I just don't know, whom to contact at Playtech. Who can give me advice?

    marko6

  25. #18
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    It is our policy not to remove threads.

    We wil however mark the thread resolved upon a resolution or let it stand as is if there is not enough evidence provided to get to a satisfactory resolution.

    Rick
    Universal4

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    Quote Originally Posted by marko6 View Post
    Rick,
    I am very happy indeed, if you or someone else at GPWA can help in this issue. That is why I posted it here. I even agree to have this thread completely removed, if Club Gold Casino pays an appropriate refund.

    But regarding proofs I believe, that Playtech is the only party that can unearth the truth. I just don't know, whom to contact at Playtech. Who can give me advice?

    marko6
    Mark,

    I'm working on getting you a good contact at Playtech - amongst other things. Rest assured that I am in your corner on this matter. I'm also working on reaching out to some other people who can help you in addition to anyone who has already posted from this community.

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    Mark....I'm curious if you checked your sent folder for emails that were sent to your rep? If you didn't you might check there because if you replied to an email the original email should be included.

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