question about sports betting stats

[PingPong]

Hi all
I hope you are all doing well!
I'm sort of new to the industry so looking for an advice. My question may sound paranoid or ambiguous, but I'm ready to provide more info and discuss it.

(Numbers are rounded for better comprehension)
For the time period "A" I've got the following data:
70 depositors
Total value of deposits - 2200 GBP.
Number of deposits - 100
Turnover - 3500 GBP
Number of bets - 1500

Is it enough input data to analyze depositor behaviour and estimate revenue?
What are your thoughts/expectations on potential revenue?
Are there any trends?

As you can guess I'm unimpressed with "my revenue", so looking for someone to share experience.

[shoeshine]

Why didn't you go for CPA? I am new to this industry but I went the CPA road. With 70 depositors you could have easily done: 2500 GBP

I might be wrong though - just some food for thought!

[Richard (OLBG)]

Hey

The fact that you arent losing money early with sports is good. Often we make a loss early on with players and only make a decent profit from the longer standing players. Its of course so different to casino as it takes so long to turnover a decent amount. So with sports bettors you really need the operator to retain them for a long time to make any money. Then the key to how much you make can often be whether your top few losing players are losing more than your bottom few winning players. Its very easy to win at sports betting these days.

The fact that they seem to be betting lots is good, indicates they could well stick around. My worry would be the turnover figure, 3500 from 1500 bets = average stake of £2.33, thats real low.

Id suggest getting some player stats to find out more.

[manuelinbmw]

I have a sports betting site which was the first site I built. It has been up for 1 1/2 years and I am barely starting to see revenue. Take rev share and wait work on seo and be patient. I only have a couple players but i am finding they are more loyal than casino. Good things will come with time.


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[PingPong]

thank you guys for your feedback - heard some interesting thoughts.

In fact, I took rev share with a long-term view and I'm still patient and committed.
Richard
I'm quite surprised with your claim - "Its very easy to win at sports betting these days."
Maybe your tips and previews are too good? But seriously, I can't say I met many winners, most probably because they don't like publicity but to my opinion it is much more easier to lose, than to win.

Surely, their behaviour is very different from casino guys, nevertheless I think every sports betting affiliate has a decent right to expect any short-term revenue as well. But as you say it seems there should be more depositing/betting cycles from each player. Difficult to accept, but OK, lets wait and see!

[Richard (OLBG)]

PingPong, this is UK punters i'm talking about especially. It's very easy to pick up a small number of winning punters which clear out your profits. We have thousands of full time bettors in the UK now, mostly traders on betfair, but many also use sportsbooks when its to their advantage and before they get restricted/closed down. We have a forum with a lot of regular winners, some who do it for a living, some make good money part time.

This is why its important in my opinion to be able to see or have access to the player stats otherwise you dont see the whole picture. Where we have seen lots of sign ups but low revenue share over a long period, its often been down to a small number of winning players who havent yet been restricted. Not all sportsbooks are really geared up to manage these winners, especially ones that are new to the UK market and probably havent experienced savvy punters in such volumes before.

Just something very key for sports betting affiliates to be aware of, which doesnt apply to the other products.

Probably isnt what you are experiencing here, but if you had high volume deposits and turnover and still low revenue, then that could be it.

If you arent getting UK traffic then its probably less of an issue, although maybe punters in other territories will get smart one day!

[TheGooner]

For the time period "A" I've got the following data:
70 depositors
Total value of deposits - 2200 GBP.
Number of deposits - 100
Turnover - 3500 GBP
Number of bets - 1500

These stats seem very abnormal to me - all the key numbers are weird.

1500 bets from 70 depositors = 22 bets per player, quite good.
2200 value from 100 deposits = 22 GBP per deposit - very low.
3500 turnover from 1500 bets = 2.33 GBP per bet - very low.

Honestly, it looks like to me you have a bonus whore churner working this bookmaker. Do you get individual account stats? Are the accounts nearly aLL following a similar pattern?

A "bonus churner" is someone who is depositing minimal amounts into a series of accounts to collect a bonus in each, and then possibly playing opposite sides of bets in different accounts to minimise losses.

Depending on the bonus percentage amount, and the turnover requirements, it might be possible for a churner to make a profit on each account once the bonus is factored in.

[PingPong]

I also find these figures quite weird, all I can add is that I noticed that vast majority of bets were in several days by one (or several) players. I never noticed many deposits in one day. Main problem that information in stats is very scanty and it is difficult to analyse it properly so I was hoping to draw an analogy with someone.

[eaton2003]

The numbers of bettors you have referred being 70 active players and the bet amounts are extremely low. I can put this down to where and who you are recruiting to bet. I guess them to be from Asia/Eastern Europe and the low end/college bettors giving gambling a go. However as mentioned before an average of £2 bet a bet seems too low and some sportsbooks would not accept action that low. Give it time and in a months time then look at your figures and decide what you can do different to get higher value gamblers.

Few sportsbooks would offer CPA based on the figures you have provided as they will end up making a considerable loss as your player value is very low.

[CoopersPick]

It should take you some time to really bring in real players that make you money but with patience and time you will accumulate enough players where u can compare statistics to see whats worth while.

[manuelinbmw]

It should take you some time to really bring in real players that make you money but with patience and time you will accumulate enough players where u can compare statistics to see whats worth while.

Yes you said it right patience is key in sports betting it takes time to build up players. But like i said before there more loyal and stay and play longer.


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[PingPong]

I believe that more than 80% of my players are from UK. I also do believe majority of them have little experience in betting. I just want some rough time/numbers estimates.
For example: what minimum conditions(n of players, amount of deposits, turnover etc..) should I meet to expect 100GBP every month.

[SportsBettingGuide]

This discussion was really helpful to us with inputs from many veterans.
Don't worry PingPong, if you stick with it long enough, learn from experience of GPWA veterans and implement those learning, you would be also be big soon..

Same goes for me too

All the best.

[PingPong]

Hi again
I did some homework:
200 depositors
Total value of deposits - 7000 GBP
Number of deposits - 350
Turnover - 15000 GBP
Number of bets - 3500
(Numbers are rounded for better comprehension)

Would you expect me to make any money?

[bonusbetting]

Which bookmaker is this with, and what kind of bonus are players getting?
Again, the average bet and the average deposits seem very low.
If people are just taking advantage of bonuses you won't make money.

I had an exclusive offer that saw 200 depositors within a few weeks because it got picked up by a bonus abuse forum, but there was no profit from it...

[Shaun O'neill]

Hi

Can you tell us what promo you are using to attract your punters is it a risk free bet with these kind of deposit amount to me it would look that way.

To work what kind of money you are going to make is pretty tough but a fair margin would be 10% so based on £15k in bets you could end up with £1500 of wins you would of course then need to deduct costs from this and then you %.

I can see that the first post on this thread was made by you in March so does that mean that you have had £15,000 in TO since march or is that your average monthly TO?

Good Luck

Shaun