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Thread: Sky Bet?!

  1. #201
    justbookies is offline Private Member
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    I actually suspect that if anyone does 'win' via the legal route, they wont be legally allowed to talk about it.

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  3. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    I wasn't below 5. I was on and off below 5. Like I said. Come back and tell us all about it, if it ever gets off this page.

    The money you **** up the wall (if it ever makes it off this page) on court costs. I'll invest back into sites to recover the 5k or so a month they screwed me out of.

    Again, instead of trying to create a big man childish argument. Why don't you just come back when you have beat Sky and say, there you go dick head.

    I'll tell you why. Because it ain't going to happen. So this childish argument is all you have.

    And I'll leave it here. I barely cone here, and there's a reason. Be back in 6. Tell me all about it son. Ta ta for now.
    Well I for one certainly appreciate your upbeat and positive contribution*. Thanks so much for stopping by. Hope to see you again soon.

    *yep, exposed myself as a liar this time.

  4. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    No in reality you save money. You have already been screwed, don't screw yourself again, just to try and spite Sky. Because it won't happen. That's all I have to say. I won't waste my time arguing, especially when most of the arguing will be done by people who won't even make it into a solicitors office.
    On the short term for sure, but on the long run... However I would the time and energy in better contracts with the programs I am working with.
    The rest of your comment is a bit childish...

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  6. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    On the short term for sure, but on the long run... However I would the time and energy in better contracts with the programs I am working with.
    The rest of your comment is a bit childish...
    The truth is childish now? It's all here mate http://www.gpwa.org/forum/skybet-cha...es-224478.html

    It's one of many threads. I'll paste the Foxy one too for the people that don't remember. Need me to dig up any more?

    This thread will be buried soon. And all the usual suspects will be jumping all over the next "I'll do this" "I'll do that" pretty sad really. But hey, I'm the childish one here.

    Anyone on the IGT partners court case yet???

    Anyway. I look forward to seeing the outcome of your court cases.

  7. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    The truth is childish now? It's all here mate http://www.gpwa.org/forum/skybet-cha...es-224478.html

    It's one of many threads. I'll paste the Foxy one too for the people that don't remember. Need me to dig up any more?

    This thread will be buried soon. And all the usual suspects will be jumping all over the next "I'll do this" "I'll do that" pretty sad really. But hey, I'm the childish one here.

    Anyone on the IGT partners court case yet???

    Anyway. I look forward to seeing the outcome of your court cases.
    You are totally missing the point, mate.

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  9. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    The truth is childish now? It's all here mate http://www.gpwa.org/forum/skybet-cha...es-224478.html

    It's one of many threads. I'll paste the Foxy one too for the people that don't remember. Need me to dig up any more?

    This thread will be buried soon. And all the usual suspects will be jumping all over the next "I'll do this" "I'll do that" pretty sad really. But hey, I'm the childish one here.

    Anyone on the IGT partners court case yet???

    Anyway. I look forward to seeing the outcome of your court cases.
    OK, I think you've made your point now and you've said you're not replying anymore at least twice. Just leave the thread to those interested and get back to building your empire.
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  11. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    You are totally missing the point, mate.
    I'm missing no point. You think other bookies / casinos will follow suit. They won't. They ain't been given a magic Google pass to rank for what they like, therefore they need their affiliates. They ain't got one of the biggest news and broadcasting stations behind them, therefore they need their affiliates. To suggest all affiliate programs will follow suit, is nothing short of hysteria.

    Well come to affiliate marketing, this is nothing new. Get over it, continue. Or throw your little paddy and empty threats around every time this happens. I'd rather just move on. It's no different than a business losing a contract or a pleb losing their minimum wage job.

    In case you have difficulty reading a contract. You signed that you or they can terminate your contract at any point. If you don't like this clause, don't sign. However you signed for this and now moan about it. I'm not justifying what Sky have done, I'm far from happy about it, but I signed it, it was already there. That is that.

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  13. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    I'm missing no point. You think other bookies / casinos will follow suit. They won't. They ain't been given a magic Google pass to rank for what they like, therefore they need their affiliates. They ain't got one of the biggest news and broadcasting stations behind them, therefore they need their affiliates. To suggest all affiliate programs will follow suit, is nothing short of hysteria.

    Well come to affiliate marketing, this is nothing new. Get over it, continue. Or throw your little paddy and empty threats around every time this happens. I'd rather just move on. It's no different than a business losing a contract or a pleb losing their minimum wage job.

    In case you have difficulty reading a contract. You signed that you or they can terminate your contract at any point. If you don't like this clause, don't sign.HoweverY you signed for this and now moan about it. I'm not justifying what Sky have done, I'm far from happy about it, but I signed it, it was already there. That is that.
    You are certainly missing the point and just keep on yelling and acting like you have some magical x-ray thing which makes it able for see you what's happening on other sides of the computer screen.

    In saturated markets, things like this happened more and not just with casinos or bookies having a tv channel. Quite naive if you think each and every deal will be respected lifetime. Brands can have all kind of reasons for this, not just a tv channel.

    I have no difficulty at all reading a contract, but they're very one-sided. That's why I try to get better contracts. It's paying off actually. Few months ago I received a "buy off" from a program stopping some revenue share deals. Be sure that's way better than just take your loss and go on to the next program that will perhaps screw you within a few years.


    But keep on wasting your time here with ignoring the point completely.

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  15. #209
    mickyfu is offline Public Member
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    You try to get better contracts, yet here you are with you Sky Contact, all nicely signed saying they can end it when they like.

    Then people quote solicitors who are onto it. Guess what, I could go and find a solicitor who would take up any old **** case, cause either way he's getting paid.

  16. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    You try to get better contracts, yet here you are with you Sky Contact, all nicely signed saying they can end it when they like.

    Then people quote solicitors who are onto it. Guess what, I could go and find a solicitor who would take up any old **** case, cause either way he's getting paid.
    Uhum, just giving my opinion here. Way before they introduced their quota I already decided to not put any effort in them. But be sure that every time programs can do this, it's popping up in the mind of others. There are dozens of reasons to do so.

    About solicitors I agree. Ask 10 of them and you get 11 opinions. Especially in case of a class action, some of them will consider it mainly as a cash cow. But it can be useful to discuss with them.

    Another reason to act before you get ripped off by some program with very one-sided terms.

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  18. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    Uhum, just giving my opinion here. Way before they introduced their quota I already decided to not put any effort in them. But be sure that every time programs can do this, it's popping up in the mind of others. There are dozens of reasons to do so.

    About solicitors I agree. Ask 10 of them and you get 11 opinions. Especially in case of a class action, some of them will consider it mainly as a cash cow. But it can be useful to discuss with them.

    Another reason to act before you get ripped off by some program with very one-sided terms.

    We all work in gambling (not that it means we like a punt) but we all work in gambling. What do you think the odds are of winning against Sky. Because I think the odds are very very slim. The reason why I will not waste my time or money

    Even if you win, it won't have an impact on the casino affiliate marketing scene. But it may if you lose, it will open the doors for others to follow suit. Now if you can honestly say that you think you will win, then maybe go ahead. But if you know deep down that you have no chance, then don't go poking the bees nest, because all you will achieve is the opposite of what you are trying to gain.

  19. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    We all work in gambling (not that it means we like a punt) but we all work in gambling. What do you think the odds are of winning against Sky. Because I think the odds are very very slim. The reason why I will not waste my time or money

    Even if you win, it won't have an impact on the casino affiliate marketing scene. But it may if you lose, it will open the doors for others to follow suit. Now if you can honestly say that you think you will win, then maybe go ahead. But if you know deep down that you have no chance, then don't go poking the bees nest, because all you will achieve is the opposite of what you are trying to gain.
    Like I said, it sounds to me like playing with San Marino at Wembley against England. But I am no lawyer or UK law expert. Of course you have to be very careful with solicitors, as they might have just money signs in their eyes, but it might be possible that in certain circumstances you have a chance.

    Just saying that if you've put quite some eggs in this basket it's worth checking what are your chances. Just taking your loss all the time, will bring more programs to this idea. And yes, also losing the case will lead to that, perhaps even worse.

    Don't get me wrong. If it makes no sense, people better not take it to court and it doesn't make sense to go to court for a few hundreds. But I would always hear what my chances are if it's about some money.

    And my point: spend time and energy better in avoiding this kind of situations in the future. I'd prefer to go to courth with "two-sided"t&c's instead of with a standard document made by the legal team of the operator. Affiliates need to. On the long run many deals that are made, are not sustainable at all, there might be situations or times that affiliate programs aren't profitable anymore, operators will drop out, etc.

  20. #213
    justbookies is offline Private Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickyfu View Post
    if you lose, it will open the doors for others to follow suit. Now if you can honestly say that you think you will win, then maybe go ahead. But if you know deep down that you have no chance, then don't go poking the bees nest, because all you will achieve is the opposite of what you are trying to gain.
    The flood gates are open already. You have already listed all the recent perpetrators, so this point is invalid. Affiliates waving the white flag is what encourages other betting companies to follow suit and steal their referrals. SkyBet is just following what other firms started. You have stated that affiliates are 'all talk no action'. You are right and that's why it is getting worse and why it'll happen more. Need to make a stand legally and say enough is enough, win or lose, because there is nothing to lose but some legal fees. Poke that bees nest - because we are already being stung.

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  22. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by justbookies View Post
    The flood gates are open already. You have already listed all the recent perpetrators, so this point is invalid. Affiliates waving the white flag is what encourages other betting companies to follow suit and steal their referrals. SkyBet is just following what other firms started. You have stated that affiliates are 'all talk no action'. You are right and that's why it is getting worse and why it'll happen more. Need to make a stand legally and say enough is enough, win or lose, because there is nothing to lose but some legal fees. Poke that bees nest - because we are already being stung.
    This.

    However, I agree with MickeyFU that losing the case might make it attractive for others to do so. But at least than everybody knows what those standard T&c's are worth. Now it's a lot of false security. If they do this, than I will do this...

    Time to get better t&c's. It will be very necessairy in the future.

  23. #215
    MJM
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    This thread has gone south quickly, which I suppose is understandable with all that is at stake.

    The solution to things like this is fairly simple in my eyes, but very unlikely to ever happen. If we collectively as a group of affiliates (and this must include many/most super affiliates) only agree to promote operators that can collectively agree to a fair set of terms and conditions that we all agree too, and perhaps use a standardized contract for, seems to be the only way. This is a selfish business that has both it's share of reputable and disreputable characters on both sides of the operating/affiliating fence, so it's unlikely to ever happen.

    Makes you think a bit about the name of the website we are using as a platform right now, GPWA = Gambling Portal Webmasters ASSOCIATION. In any other industry this would likely stand for something, I am of the opinion that it really doesn't for ours. Maybe that should change? Maybe it's an impossible prospect.

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  25. #216
    mickyfu is offline Public Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by MJM View Post
    This thread has gone south quickly, which I suppose is understandable with all that is at stake.

    The solution to things like this is fairly simple in my eyes, but very unlikely to ever happen. If we collectively as a group of affiliates (and this must include many/most super affiliates) only agree to promote operators that can collectively agree to a fair set of terms and conditions that we all agree too, and perhaps use a standardized contract for, seems to be the only way. This is a selfish business that has both it's share of reputable and disreputable characters on both sides of the operating/affiliating fence, so it's unlikely to ever happen.

    Makes you think a bit about the name of the website we are using as a platform right now, GPWA = Gambling Portal Webmasters ASSOCIATION. In any other industry this would likely stand for something, I am of the opinion that it really doesn't for ours. Maybe that should change? Maybe it's an impossible prospect.
    Ha ha ha ha ha. And there was me thinking that is what this forum is about.......

    Not directed at anyone. However I wonder how many affiliates are complaining on this very thread, who have already ran back to Foxy. Come on, hold your hands up.

  26. #217
    bettingspin is offline Private Member
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    I think realistically what the SkyBet issue has outlined (and others in the past) are:
    1 - We are all subject to a CEO decision who could decide to cut our revenue without giving us any compensation (regardless of the outcome of winning a potential case vs SkyBet which I won't comment on it at this stage as I am not a lawyer)
    2 - This industry do not have audit and everyone can play with our revenue behind doors as they like
    3 - I hate how the Guardian and others are spinning this towards affiliate being rogue and giving misleading tips although honestly I can see some rogue affiliates doing this on social media - not that I justify who follow them as it should be clear enough but if the system gets regulated some of our competitors who are acting in a way they shouldn't, should also pay the price. But it doesn't mean everyone who act correctly should

    The only solution to the problem would be to create a serious affiliate body who would stand for affiliates in different ways:
    1 - Affiliate Selection - Not just doing deals and acting as middle-man or just forums like this one / Literally assisting and filtering genuine affiliates and policing them carefully. Also making sure they do follow the regulation and do not cause problems to bookmakers who still have a license to defend. It will also answer what Skybet is using as an excuse about the lack of control in the affiliate business and related risks.
    2 - Contracts - negotiate on behalf of the affiliates who are part of the group and that are serious and genuine in what they do contracts that are fair. If each of us go to a bookie and ask for a contract, I guarantee you get 99% reply that we either accept their terms or leave. If a body representing a large number of genuine affiliates do that, is a chance that it will succeed. In doing so it means bookmakers will benefit from 1) and affiliates will be incentivised in working fairly as they have a fair contract and a commitment to stay in the group.

    I think this is the only way but it has to be funded and has to be supported by small, medium and large affiliates. It will benefit everyone. I would pay a fee to someone doing the services above as it will help my business to be more secure overtime and therefore avoid those things with Skybet will continue. If we are not able to organise ourselves and act separately as we have always done, keep accepting their one-sided tick-boxes than let's not be surprised (and I include myself) when on a Monday morning we get such emails full of lies and lose our revenue!

    If someone is interested please contact me in private and we can discuss more as I am willing to help and work in a project like this but needs back up

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  28. #218
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    I cant answer to pms because i don't have 10 posts, damn this site :grr:

    Hope it won't get "all talk no action" situation but unfortunately i smell bad news

  29. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by justbookies View Post
    I actually suspect that if anyone does 'win' via the legal route, they wont be legally allowed to talk about it.
    one more reason to stay anonymous on forums
    We are all bloodsucking ticks, hungry, devious
    each one latched on to the ass of the previous
    when the last and the first latch on it can be shown
    ass-blood sucked by the first from the last is his own

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  31. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyros90 View Post
    I cant answer to pms because i don't have 10 posts, damn this site :grr:

    Hope it won't get "all talk no action" situation but unfortunately i smell bad news
    If you're waiting for a class action, it won't happen. Class action usually means people wanting to go to court without spending themselves too much money and time in it... A lot of hikers, but very few to none drivers.

    Also, every case might be different, depending on when you signed up, which amendments you've clicked and what you've agreed besides the t&c with Sky.

    If you're screwed, I should go yourself to some expert instead of waiting what others will do. Class action is difficult, also because if you're winning or winning partly, decisions have to be made. It's difficult to decide about the directions with 53 captains on the ship.
    Last edited by Triple7; 6 September 2017 at 2:49 pm.

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