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    Default The top 10 countries to live in when you're older





    If you were wondering where you should spend your old age, Switzerland wouldn’t be a bad bet


    The home of good chocolate, holey cheese, and the man who brought flat-pack furniture to the world, is the best place for older people to live according to a new report from HelpAge International and the University of Southampton

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    Definitely not #9

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    @ Shay See LOl Better thanks for the advice makes my life a little easier also. I'm a good Learner .


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    Nice subject.

    Sweden, Germany, Netherlands and UK will be not so nice anymore within some time I am afraid. Japan is difficult for someone who isn't Japanese, I think.

    I would prefer Israel or somewhere in Middle/South America, for example Chile, Uruguay, Paraguay, Colombia, etc. Or Eastern Europe: Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary...

    Where this topic always had some kind of "dream"-factor, it could be hard reality within some time.
    Last edited by Triple7; 9 September 2015 at 12:33 pm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    I would prefer Israel or somewhere in Middle/South America, for example Chile, Uruguay, Paraguay, Colombia, etc. Or Eastern Europe: Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary...
    I may be out of the loop but isn't Israel dangerous with its current political climate?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Casinorep View Post
    I may be out of the loop but isn't Israel dangerous with its current political climate?
    I don't think it's that dangerous for now. Israel is one of those few states that makes work of protecting their people. But, you've got a point that Israel is surrounded with enemies and depends very much on intern and extern political developments. Intern, because they also have left wing parties with dangerous ideas and extern because many of their allies have a growing number of Israel-haters in their countries.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    somewhere in Middle/South America, for example Chile, Uruguay, Paraguay, Colombia, etc. Or Eastern Europe: Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary...
    I have fled from the second group to the first group you quote, now moving partly to Paraguay from Brazil as well, which is a very nice country; if you do not want it that much wild, Uruguay is better.

    I can only say (as much as I like things in South America and things in Eastern Europe), that there is no country that is even close to a dream I want to live in. Every country has many pros and much much more cons.

    It is obvious, that 1st world is s*** in all aspects (human relationships, economical and social development, Authoritarian regime 2.0 etc., overregulation), but it is very convenient and one can rest there in a way that everything works and is cheap. Yes, cheap.. if you have some money, the value is in the 1st world, because even when some things (especially housing or services) are more expensive, they have very high standards. In South America, it does not help that you save some money, but you buy things with very erratic quality that can not be predicted. Not to mention security. I am not talking about violence. I feel in South America as secure as in Japan (much more secure than in any European country), because when you do not do crazy things and you do not live in a city, you can choose very safe way to live. I talk about health insurance, helicopter assistance in case of emergency etc. There are good and pricey hospitals in Brazil, but only in cities and paramedics are poor for example. I see dead people on streets almost every month because of car accidents and I do not drive a lot. The value of human life is very low here (not to mention poor animals).

    In Eastern Europe you get sometimes even cheaper services than in South America and with much higher quality (not that high as in the west, but the gap is almost not seen when you come from South America), so when you do not want to give up western standards completely and you want to save a lot of money, EE seems tempting. Decent security. But the people there are dicks. The culture of Eastern Europe was decimated in previous decades and centuries. If you go there as tourist, you will not see it. If you live there, you will feel the hate underneath everywhere. It emerges now with the refugee case. I think most people everywhere are not happy with them, but most people from Eastern Europe seriously want to shoot them at the border. The hate and fear in Eastern Europe is hyped to the max. I can not say I am big fan of western liberal postmodern values and the western propaganda, but what happens in the East Europe is a pseudoconservative backfire that is also ugly. Eastern Europe attitude is changing rapidly from US to Russia (and EE nations always needed and will need some leading nation, that they will copy to the extreme, because of total lack of self-confidence).

    My conclusion as expat is that the articles about the best 10 countries to live is just useless mindporn. There is nothing like ideal country, ideal wife, ideal job or ideal affiliate program.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple7 View Post
    I don't think it's that dangerous for now. Israel is one of those few states that makes work of protecting their people. But, you've got a point that Israel is surrounded with enemies and depends very much on intern and extern political developments. Intern, because they also have left wing parties with dangerous ideas and extern because many of their allies have a growing number of Israel-haters in their countries.
    I was just dating with a Jew who lived in Israel with her whole family. I think it is a beautiful country, I think the passion of the people is very nice, I think the IT boom there is remarkable (however I would be curious how it really is, because the Israeli affiliate managers are absolutely the worst to deal with). But seriously... it is a strict authoritarian regime. Not to mention they are racists, so to get there when you are non-Jew, is nearly impossible.
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    My grandmother was Jewish, that's enough to get there. She was also the mother of my mother. Orthodox Jews would consider me Jewish, while liberal Jews won't, as I'm practising Catholic. They're racist? Perhaps, you're right, but I consider it the only way they can survive. Acting like Europe does, means suicide over there.

    Affiliate managers are everywhere the same in my eyes. It depends on with who you're dealing with. If you deal with lower Israeli affiliate employees, it's a nightmare and some of the Israeli programs (888, William Hill, 777 Affiliates) are indeed really terrible. With some others I got good experiences, but after I told them directly how things are and I was able to deal with some more senior affiliate manager.

    I agree 100% that no country is perfect. Everywhere it's something, also in South America. But, for some one doing his business, making his money I think it isn't that bad at all. I liked it over there, more than in Europe to be honest. But I realize that with a moderate income, life is much better in Europe. For now. For better quality education for the kids, health, extra security, etc, you're paying in South America. But, it's no Zimbabwe, neither Syria...like you mentioned, using your common sense will save you from a lot of troubles. I got robbed twice in 4 years over there. That also happens in the bigger cities in Europe. To see how they threat animals is sad. But... same here, in Asia, in Africa, in Spain, in Eastern Europe, etc. In general people do threat animals not very well.

    Eastern Europe is South America + but with some things different. Also it's difficult to compare countries. Czech is totally another thing than for example Bulgaria and Romania is another kettle of fish than Poland. I am more positive about the people there. Also their opinions about the refugees I do understand. Lots of them are just coming for profit and lots of them do not even want to stay in safe countries, but just want to go to Sweden or Germany. They're not asylum seekers, they're asylum demanders and they're prepared to use violence when they do not get what they want. Many Eastern Europeans work hard in the West, are doing for a few euro the dirty jobs Western Europeans feel too good for and rent an appartment and stay there with 8 people in some dirty part of the city, because their low salary does not allow them any thing more. And than... some asylum demanders are getting houses for them selves in peaceful villages... I can imagine what they think.


    And most of them got more values that I like than the average Western guy nowadays has in Western Europe... Also the worries of many of them are honest and I cannot say that I disagree with that worries.

    But this is my opinion, 100 people, 100 opinions and 100 preferred places to live

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    I would recommend New Zealand.
    Temperate climate, good food supply, under-populated, no crazy neighbours (well Australia - but they are not dangerous crazy!)


    The only downside is that medical treatment is probably 5-10 years behind US / Europe ...
    And you probably need to bring money with you to live well - island economy so things are more expensive than major countries.

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    I never said they are racist and it is bad. Do not take me wrong. I am trying to be as objective as possible. Yes, I agree that the only way for them to survive, is to be hardliners. However good life is not just survival under permanent threat, that is being felt by many Jews, even when there is no threat at all.

    I do not like the "deal-driven" approach by Israelis when it is about affiliate marketing. It might work when you sell tomatoes or weapons of mass destruction, but this approach is destructing affiliate business a lot. Affiliate marketing should be long term partnership, where both parties should be stuck in long term deals, even when it does not pay off during some time. The trust is vanishing. I know it sounds like I blame Jews...

    You hit the nail. For average income, the South America is NOT good. It is a cheap country, especially Paraguay but now Brazilian Real went from 1.6 to almost 4.0 to USD and is cheap as well, but when you need something with good quality... it may have infinite price. Like railroad system. I love trains for example, I almost had orgasms in Japanese Shinkansens, when I made it from Osaka/Tokyo anywhere in few hours in high comfort. But even European trains are very nice. In South America they destroyed all trains few decades ago. Even now I can not believe that 2 cities 40M alltogether, only 350km away (Rio-Sao), do not have bullet trains or any trains in between! Traffic jams kill even wealthy people. The only option is to buy a helicopter. If it were services in Europe, I would buy one. But here, as everything is so complicated... My car is being repaired FROM MARCH now. What about if something happens with heli... The way how to survive in South America is:
    1. to stay low profile
    2. to have deep pockets for emergency situations that will happen all the time

    The approach to animals is much worse here than elsewhere. I see cats, dogs, horses dying on streets all the time. Nobody gives a ****. I saved few cats and make them nice life, but still I have to leave other dying. My idiotic neighbor has a dog, that is all the time on 1 meter lead, so I see his sad noise all day and night. My Brazilian friend, who is completely broke (as almost every Brazilian), has 13 dogs in his small house. People just throw young dogs over his fence, because they see he has many. Once he had 34 dogs. He has no money for his own food, but he is feeding dogs, but he is an exception. I see horses with open wounds and flesh full of flies, dying on streets. Groups of wild dogs everywhere. This is the shady side of South America.

    I am Czech and I disagree about the people and about the differences between EE countries. Yes, it is true that in Central East Europe even every two close towns have differencesin languages, habits, cusines. But generally there are some similarities from Burgas to Szczecin. All are small nations, without ocean, between Russia and western Europe, looking desperately for identity, with Hungary exception Slavic nations. Many have similar history under 300 years Habsburg rule (Austro-Hungarian). I know people from other nations and even when the nations like to point out differences between them, there are no major differences and all the people there have huge fear that is starting to emerge. That is why I left after all.

    I do not argue about refugees. You are right. The Eastern Europeans are people risen as second grade people, so they behave like that. With humility that is sadly, changing into servility. But I do not talk about refugees, I talk about the people. The Eastern Europeans care only about themselves, they lost the "big picture". They forgot how big the world is. They serve to Austria, then to Russia, now they are dogs of USA or EU/Germany. There are no big leaders in nations where the best people leave the countries for centuries. The rest of people live in fear and the last thing they care is international politics. They thought Ukraine or Syria is too far, that their own small business is more important and now everyone is surprised. Look at Israel - small country, but they know, that they can not stop fighting ever, if they want to survive. They have an Ally (US), but they are not US servants. From former Eastern bloc maybe only Tito/Yugoslavia was able to play some hard game. The Eastern Europeans are weak in short. They pay for that and it ends as their frustration, that is on everyone. Vaclav Havel once said it is "constant bad mood".

    We are all naive about other cultures, until we live there for couple of years. If you plan to go there, I can only say: Yes go there. It has much more value for foreigner than for insider. But be prepared for big ****. I bought now appartment in EE, I go there for vacation for few weeks/months a year, when I need illusion of stability. I enjoy things there, but as I wrote before: the question about ONE country where to live, makes no sense in 21st century. More here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpet...ve_Flag_Theory Eastern Europe is only a good "playground". South America is perfect as official residence.
    Last edited by Sherlock; 9 September 2015 at 5:38 pm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGooner View Post
    I would recommend New Zealand.
    Temperate climate, good food supply, under-populated, no crazy neighbours (well Australia - but they are not dangerous crazy!)


    The only downside is that medical treatment is probably 5-10 years behind US / Europe ...
    And you probably need to bring money with you to live well - island economy so things are more expensive than major countries.
    Just curious. I read some horrible stories about internet connection there. Is that right or some rumor?
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    Last several years, every year, i live several months in Thailand. From my point of view - very good country. Very friendly people.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sherlock View Post
    Just curious. I read some horrible stories about internet connection there. Is that right or some rumor?
    Hard for me to say - because I don't know what "horrible stories" you've read?

    The major cities are rolling out "ultra-fast" broadband - which is fibre optics - and matches most European cities.
    Smaller towns have to make do with older infrastructure - over copper wires - but it's still 20-30mb.

    I'm rural (living in countryside) and get 15-20mb per second speeds as standard.
    This is enough to stream HD video, and access most functions without issue.

    An "unlimited" usage plan at that speed costs around $100 local per month for phone line and access.
    $100 local = Euro 56 = USD 61 = approx 5 hours work.

    Is that horrible?

    EDIT :
    With research - I have found out there are remote areas where the only real method to access broadband internet is not via phone line - or even wireless - but via satellite dish (much like TV dish - but slightly bigger) and these speeds may be slower as it is pointing to remote satelites - perhaps 4-8mb speeds.

    But these are remote locations and farming communities - gravel roads - big scenery - and properties of 10km2 or more - farms - national forests - mountains etc. If you are living in / near a town then my speed is more normal.
    Last edited by TheGooner; 9 September 2015 at 8:27 pm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGooner View Post
    I would recommend New Zealand.
    Temperate climate, good food supply, under-populated, no crazy neighbours (well Australia - but they are not dangerous crazy!)


    The only downside is that medical treatment is probably 5-10 years behind US / Europe ...
    And you probably need to bring money with you to live well - island economy so things are more expensive than major countries.
    I was going to say that I'm surprised Oz and NZ are not on the list.

    And you're right, we ARE crazy, but not dangerous crazy (anymore).

    The one thing that would likely stop europeans from living here is our nanny state laws. We have some strict ones, but to be fair we also have one of the lowest crime rates in the world. Since semi and automatic guns were banned there has been no huge shootings (apart from the bikie gangs, and drug related shootings) and our ASIO guys are bloody good at what they do, so the rate of terror related incidences is very low. We do have some looneys but they generally act alone and are caught before any major damage is done.

    We are pretty lucky to live in such a great country.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moonlight Cat View Post
    Last several years, every year, i live several months in Thailand. From my point of view - very good country. Very friendly people.
    Looks very tasty - but as I get older I don't like big cities so much.
    Asian cities are typically dirty and crowded.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGooner View Post
    Is that horrible?
    No, that is really not horrible I just read some rumor that I did not believe in.

    What is horrible is South America.
    Wind, rain = internet goes down. Weekends = more people = internet is very slow, 2+ years ago was down completely.

    Landlines with no capacity in 50K ppl town (I remember 4 years ago I paid >100USD for 256kbit which was unstable too ). Local wifi providers overcrowded and during peak goes down as well. After wind antennas go down, they react even after 1 week.
    Best from worse solutions are 3g mobile operators. One year ago speed was limited to 1mbit (which was rarely reached), now it is 6mbit, but at 5AM, during day I am happy for ~ 1.5mbit. But yes, even now the internet is down couple of hours a day.

    The best experience is when you solve something with CS of any operator. Waiting on line is usual even >1hour. Everything must be solved over phone. Brazilians sometimes do not understand each other, so for foreigner it is even more funny. When you reach a point which they do not want to answer, they just hang up. They do it even to locals.

    I for example cancelled the internet of 256kbit 3 years ago. Well I thought so, because I was at office and got paper (it took me like 5x 200km drive during traffic jams = 5days lost). But they were still charging me. It ended up in something like collection agency. I am solving it for 3 years now. It has no end.

    There are countless stories like that. I went to Policia Federal (again 200km), I went there maybe 50x to extend my visa, until they finally said "no", even when I am obliged to get them. Last time I parked for 5 mins where I should not. I just saw my car being towed away. Ok. I took a cab, followed the car. At the parking lot they denied me to go to car for documents, sent me 300km away to get some notarized copies, few more documents that I did not even have etc etc etc.

    So living in South America means that you spend half a year with stupidities like that. The only but huge surplus is that if you survive, nobody cares about you. I gave up even the visa, it is much better overstaying and then somehow get into the country. The worst approach here is to try doing things properly.

    In the USA/Europe/OECD countries people generally understand the concept of effectivity and how state and society should work and the plan is more or less followed. Then there are more or less corrupted politicians and state employees, who overprice everything and take bribes. That is a model of western capitalism.

    In South America (and probably in Africa) people do not even know what effectivity is. That time is money. Brazilian Portuguese has one word for "making money" and "winning money". So my choleric breakups after weeks wasted with something trivial even do not scare people. They do not know why the Gringo is upset, when everything is normal. Even the bribes do not work here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGooner View Post
    Asian cities are typically dirty and crowded.
    Not everywhere for sure. Typical Japanese street is cleaner than my table. I guess the Asian cities of the richest countries are the most clean on planet. (And there are no garbage bins)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sherlock View Post
    From former Eastern bloc maybe only Tito/Yugoslavia was able to play some hard game.
    Not in eastern bloc and never was. Hence the hard game.

    But I digress. I'd choose Japan as they respect old people, as opposed to pushing them out of the way like in some other countries.

    The Global AgeWatch Index assessed the social and economic wellbeing of the older population in 96 countries around the world, by measuring income, health, education and employment, and the enabling environment.
    This makes the whole study a joke. They in fact assessed the things that happened much earlier in one's life such as income, education and employment. Plus they totally ignored the non-western-world countries because the stats of those countries aren't quantifiable or they don't have them.

    Old age is about happiness and family, and here they go talking about wealth basically.

    This is what you get when you start talking about countries by looking at their stats, as opposed to actually understanding a country. This was a futile attempt by a data scientist to level the playground for all countries and choose the best one.

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