View Poll Results: Is it acceptable for affiliate managers to operate their own affiliate sites?

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  • Yes: it is their own business and they should be able to do it if they want.

    10 20.41%
  • Yes: but only if their employer agrees and they are open about it with their affiliates.

    15 30.61%
  • Yes: but only if they are open about it and do it to understand affiliates better rather than making money.

    2 4.08%
  • Maybe: I think it is a very touchy matter even if it is out in the open.

    2 4.08%
  • No: I think it is just plain inappropriate for an affiliate manager be an affiliate too.

    9 18.37%
  • No: Affiliate mangers should be prohibited by their affiliate programs from being an affiliate under any circumstances.

    11 22.45%
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  1. #1
    MichaelCorfman's Avatar
    MichaelCorfman is online now GPWA Executive Director
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    Question Is it acceptable for affiliate managers to operate their own affiliate sites?

    Last week cass started a thread about whether is was a conflict of interest for an affiliate manager to operate an affiliate site of their own.

    Here is the thread: Affiliate managers who have their own portals... .

    A few posts in, GFPC suggested it would be interesting to have a poll on this topic. So, I decided to make the question this week's question of the week.

    Let us know what you think.

    Michael
    GPWA Executive Director, Casino City CEO, Friend to the Village Idiot

    Resources for Affiliates: iGamingDirectory.com, iGamingAffiliatePrograms.com, GamingMeets.com

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  3. #2
    GFPC is offline Private Member
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    Thanks for the poll Michael. This is great. I will be watching this extensively.

    I voted for option number 2 - that yes it is acceptable as long as their employer agrees and they are open about it in the affiliate community.

    Anyone should really be able to do this as long as no conflicts of interest are created and full disclosure is given to the community.

    It is happening on a big scale already and i would argue many AMS here at the GPWA already have their own portals...

    I know if i was offered the right position and reward (financially) I would consider taking an offer to be an affiliate manager and have no qualms about keeping my online portals and do both.

    If the employer was not happy about it and wanted me to discontinue being an affiliate i doubt i would take the offer. I love being an affiliate and also would not mind experiencing being an AM to learn more about that aspect of the industry.


  4. #3
    radicaldomains is offline Public Member
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    Doesn't matter.

    If you are an affiliate manager, then you have a job managing affiliates and taking care of business, if you can do this in only a few minutes a day you are not doing your job, so I doubt you are in any position to benefit.

    Most affiliate managers cant see what their affiliates are doing and how, only the sites listed on their profile. I dont think they have access to logs and stuff.

    Sales, and basic listed sites...

    There's nothing to learn.. I have more problems with showing the affiliate runners themselves the tricks of the trade, more worried there than I am some affiliate manager...

    Again should not matter, just request you do not want an affiliate manager on your account... They are there to help the nubs mostly, i never had one help set me straight.. only tell me you should add a banner here, or ok your check was sent..

  5. #4
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    I voted for option 2. I agree with pretty much everything Steve said. If an AM is able to do both effectively, no skin off my nose.
    Terry - The Pokerkeep
    President / CEO - Gambling Affiliates Union

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    Email: admin @ thepokerkeep.com



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    Yea, tough one. I voted that the AM's shouldn't be affiliates as well. This could breed intellectual property theft.

    What we've done here at LCP is to a offer significant performance incentives based on the affiliates revenues (success).

    Disclaimer: Now please keep in mind that I was once an affiliate before starting LCP. My sites are now direct marketing for the brands. I have not received any complaints. Even though I wouldn't want our AM's to have their own sites.

    I've posted an anecdotal story here of why: https://www.gpwa.org/forum/showthrea...282#post620282

  8. #6
    GFPC is offline Private Member
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    Getting interesting! Thanks for your thoughts Adrian. Let me ask your honest opinion here if you do not mind mate.

    When you were an affiliate a while back as WagerX - if this question was asked back then do you think your vote would be different?

    Reason i ask is because considering you own properties right now I could see how views can change from being an affiliate to being a property owner.

    I am just curious about that.

    Secondly - This is your own case where you personally would not want employees to operate their own portals.

    But do you think if other Employers (operators) think it would be okay, would that be acceptable?

    Great poll so far!! Loving it!


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  10. #7
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    IMO under no circumstances should an affiliate manager also be an affiliate for the program they manage - leaves way too much area to abuse the power. Ive heard many stories over the years of managers retagging players.

    I reckon if they have the time and really want to be an affiliate - they should only be permitted to affiliate with other programs not their own.

  11. #8
    Christoff is offline Public Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkyt View Post
    IMO under no circumstances should an affiliate manager also be an affiliate for the program they manage - leaves way too much area to abuse the power. Ive heard many stories over the years of managers retagging players.

    I reckon if they have the time and really want to be an affiliate - they should only be permitted to affiliate with other programs not their own.
    I agree entirely here - I've worked for one particular company where the ex-head of affiliates was there since day 1 and tagged lots of high rollers to his daughter's affiliate account.

    Anyway, it was stopped but it does go on.

    I think that if an AM wants to develop a portal, that's fine - but it can't impact their job in any way.

  12. #9
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    Interesting poll really gets you thinking. I voted number 2. But only if their employer agrees.

  13. #10
    GFPC is offline Private Member
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    Yeah so far its a great poll! Its one of those polls that seems to split down the middle with affiliates and others!!


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    Quote Originally Posted by GFPC View Post
    Getting interesting! Thanks for your thoughts Adrian. Let me ask your honest opinion here if you do not mind mate.

    When you were an affiliate a while back as WagerX - if this question was asked back then do you think your vote would be different?
    I think my concerns would have been the same. Now, with a new developing skill set I see more of the dangers that this could generate. So my concerns are the same, but the level of understanding has increased.

    Quote Originally Posted by GFPC View Post
    Secondly - This is your own case where you personally would not want employees to operate their own portals.

    But do you think if other Employers (operators) think it would be okay, would that be acceptable?
    If one of our affiliate manager wanted to be an affiliate then it would have to be another niche. Also, due to the performance incentives it makes more sense to support the affiliates making more than being an affiliate themselves.



    Quote Originally Posted by Christoff
    I agree entirely here - I've worked for one particular company where the ex-head of affiliates was there since day 1 and tagged lots of high rollers to his daughter's affiliate account.
    That's criminal! That's worse than my other story of the affiliate stealing intellectual property.

    For the record. the players at LiveCasinoPartners can NOT have their tags modified, performance modified, deposists etc from the IncomeAccess level or the software companies. They intentionally inhibit the operators for this exact reason. They (like me) prefer the long term reputation building strategy.

    Cheers!

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  16. #12
    GFPC is offline Private Member
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    Thanks Adrian. I understand your point of view! I am still sided with the fact as long as the employer is ok with it - it should not be a problem. But also the AM would need to be open about it to the community.

    I would understand if some affiliates decided not to work the affiliate program because of the fact they own their own portals - but I do not think it should become an industry norm and something recognized as a "NORM"

    Imo it really should be up to the affiliate program and the person working as their AM, as it would be their business. Whether or not the affiliate manager be allowed to promote the room they work for - that I would need to think about a bit more. I could understand a little more the hesitation of affiliates on that matter though.


  17. #13
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    IMO Adrian is upfront, honest and totally transparant and believes in what he does and what he stands for. One should not forget there are not that many programs that give you that kind of loyalty and can be found as an active member on forums.

    Live dealer games at golden tiger casino

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  19. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkyt View Post
    IMO under no circumstances should an affiliate manager also be an affiliate for the program they manage - leaves way too much area to abuse the power.
    I don't see what the difference is between an affiliate manager operating a portal for the casinos he/she works for and promoting them, as to the same casinos setting up portals and using their SEO departments to competing against their affiliate partners.

    It's got the point where a % of affiliates sites are nothing more than free billboards.
    Remember if the affiliate makes zero income for the online gaming program they promote, the gaming properties still receives free Branding.

    IMO it's all wrong and shouldn't happen but it does and we're all being shafted because of it.


    Cheers


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  21. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkyt View Post
    IMO under no circumstances should an affiliate manager also be an affiliate for the program they manage - leaves way too much area to abuse the power. Ive heard many stories over the years of managers retagging players.

    I reckon if they have the time and really want to be an affiliate - they should only be permitted to affiliate with other programs not their own.
    I voted #2 as well. If an AM is open about what they do with both their employer and others, then go for it. I do, however, agree with arkyt when he suggests not operating as an affiliate for your own program.

    As a former operator this was an ethical question that came up a lot; do we create our own portals (the answer was sure, why not), and then do we compete with our existing affiliates through paid advertising (PPC, etc), and the answer to that was no.

    I think that operators, and AMs, need to respect the affiliates that are promoting them by not making it more difficult or costly for them to do their jobs by competing directly in paid advertising venues, including search.

  22. #16
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    I have no problem as long as they aren't using insider info to compete with their affiliates.

  23. #17
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    IMO it's all wrong and shouldn't happen but it does and we're all being shafted because of it.
    I do most certainly agree, temptation for some never lets them down.

    My vote is no under no circumstances.

    greek39

  24. #18
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    "MO under no circumstances should an affiliate manager also be an affiliate for the program they manage - leaves way too much area to abuse the power. Ive heard many stories over the years of managers retagging players".



    With regard to the above, it stands to reason that affiliate managers should not own or manage their own portal casinos, since it's in direct conflict with their employer's brand. Potentially it could create an atmosphere where affiliates managers who are supposed to support affiliates will eventually be in direct competition with them.

    So why assist someone if you're competing for the same source?

    Internet casinos

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  26. #19
    Roulette Zeitung is offline Public Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelCorfman View Post
    Last week cass started a thread about whether is was a conflict of interest for an affiliate manager to operate an affiliate site of their own.

    Here is the thread: Affiliate managers who have their own portals... .
    Four years later, the current situation shows that, this poll is today more topical than ever.
    Ancient scrolls ... sometimes ... revealing the mysteries of current days!
    If old posts are worth nothing, then we can stop writing forever.

    Read the scrolls ...

    (This is the correct link to the starting point of the thread: https://www.gpwa.org/forum/affiliate...ls-193219.html)

    ... and if you are finished, then read this unbelievable current case of Jo Arild Remme, his Pyramid shemes and an assumed LeoJackpot whistleblower, and you will understand, why this topic is so important and why parts of industry standing on the crumbling edge of abyss:

    ===> https://www.gpwa.org/forum/another-o...tml#post772739



    Leopold
    Last edited by Roulette Zeitung; 20 November 2014 at 4:38 am.

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  28. #20
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    Is a bit like a bank worker has his own credit advice company during after office hours.

    In theory, it wouldn't be a problem, but in reality you see casino's buying premium TLDs, using their SEO power and putting up "neutral review sites" where they are promoting just their own brands. Average customer doesn't even notice this sort of things and just clicks... Oh, they even have a GPWA seal on their website

    Trend is that this is happening more and more. I bet in 10 - 15 years, they all have very powerful affiliate sites... and for the bigger affiliates from today are resting just some breadcrumbs.

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