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Am I being shaved?
I'm a newer affiliate and I've always heard the horror stories about being shaved. I'm working with a casino right now (whom I'm not going to mention at this moment) and I'm seeing a big discrepancy in conversions compared to one other casino that I've worked with.
The other casino that I worked with, I was converting 1 player with less than 150 clicks. With this casino, I've sent them a total of over 1000 click, over 131 unique downloads, over 50 real registration and got only 1 converting player.
This Casino has a great reputation so I don't want to jump to the conclusion that I'm getting shaved. But I have to know if this is common. Do you guys experience the same type of discrepancy?
<table style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 529pt;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="705"><col style="width: 145pt;" width="193"> <col style="width: 48pt;" span="8" width="64"> <tbody><tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td style="height: 14.4pt; width: 145pt;" align="left" height="19" width="193">Date </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> Visits </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> Downloads </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> Unique Downloads </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> Fun Registrations </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> Real Registrations </td> <td style="width: 48pt;" align="left" width="64"> New Purchasing Players </td> <td colspan="2" style="width: 96pt;" align="left" width="128"> Purchasing </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/12/2010</td> <td align="right">10</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/13/2010</td> <td align="right">18</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/14/2010</td> <td align="right">8</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/15/2010</td> <td align="right">2</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/17/2010</td> <td align="right">3</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/18/2010</td> <td align="right">86</td> <td align="right">24</td> <td align="right">9</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">3</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/19/2010</td> <td align="right">214</td> <td align="right">48</td> <td align="right">30</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">10</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/20/2010</td> <td align="right">155</td> <td align="right">44</td> <td align="right">20</td> <td align="right">2</td> <td align="right">10</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/21/2010</td> <td align="right">200</td> <td align="right">62</td> <td align="right">29</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">13</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/22/2010</td> <td align="right">68</td> <td align="right">28</td> <td align="right">15</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">7</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/23/2010</td> <td align="right">40</td> <td align="right">22</td> <td align="right">10</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">3</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/24/2010</td> <td align="right">62</td> <td align="right">13</td> <td align="right">7</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">2</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td class="xl63" style="height: 14.4pt;" align="right" height="19">2/25/2010</td> <td align="right">82</td> <td align="right">23</td> <td align="right">10</td> <td align="right">2</td> <td align="right">3</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td align="right">0</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td style="height: 14.4pt;" align="left" height="19">Page Total (30 Detail Records)</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td style="height: 14.4pt;" align="left" height="19">Total </td> <td align="right">972</td> <td align="right">265</td> <td align="right">131</td> <td align="right">8</td> <td align="right">51</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td style="height: 14.4pt;" align="left" height="19">Grand Total (30 Detail Records)</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> <td>
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 14.4pt;" height="19"> <td style="height: 14.4pt;" align="left" height="19">Total </td> <td align="right">972</td> <td align="right">265</td> <td align="right">131</td> <td align="right">8</td> <td align="right">51</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td align="right">1</td> <td>
</td></tr></tbody></table>
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Hi TripleClubs,
You can get a heap of real registrations but if they are from sign up deals where the player gets $1000 and 1 hours free play time, then your going to see these results.
Your stats can be influence by a lot of variables.
The most likely of these is the type of traffic/visitors your sending to the casino.
If it's broad based traffic, your depositing players will be a lot less than if you are sending target traffic.
Also months change.
But by taking a sample over a 12 month period for example will give you a much better idea as to your true traffic potential.
Also when you've been in the game a bit longer you'll have other stats to compare these with.
NB - Just because site X makes a decent income from affiliate program Z, this doesn't mean you will. Even if your site is similar to site X.
One point. I checked out your sites and all except one is using the same skin. I like the design of this skin it's both professional looking and easy to navigate, well done :clap:
But it's possible that the same people are finding these sites as they seem to target the same niche.
If it was me I'd be making each site uniquely different; if only in design layout.
Experience in this game is what you'll find is paramount to making a decent income. To achieve that, persistence is the key.
Oh and like surfing the 10,000 hour rule applies here too :eyebrow:
Cheers
:wave:
Dave
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Thanks Aussie. These real registration was through a welcome bonus promotion.
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I have a habit of editing and adding.
Reiterating the 10,000 hour surfing rule applies here also.
Cheers
:wave:
Dave
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Lol, nice to see you found some interest in my articles. Good point!
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So your basically saying my conversions suck because I'm an inexperienced affiliates.
Either that or I haven't run enough traffic to determine if my conversions are bad. I was going to stop running traffic to this casino. Is it too soon?
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I think it depends totally on the offer these people are getting to make a judgment...
If they are playing a free spins offer I would say that still looks a little less than average, but I don't think there is enough data to distinguish "shaving" as you've suggested. Also, how long have you been promoting them? Is this the first month? And how are you promoting them? Are your visitors seeing on your site what they are signing up for? This could be another reason why you don't see depositors.. Have a look at the way you're pushing the brand to make sure the player's aren't being sent somewhere to find they are not getting what they clicked for ;)
Lastly, if you really want to know, why not get a friend to sign up through your affiliate id and test it out?
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51 real registrations - one guess is they had trouble depositing.
But like Renee said it has to be tested.
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the more well known / well spoke about places deserve a little longer trial time MHO, but you should never keep listing places that don't earn something you'd consider fair income for space given ... because the places that DO earn you money deserve better than to be sitting next to a free rider.
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You have a relative explosion of traffic from the 18th, then a mighty fall on the 22nd. It looks unlikely to be from search engines. Is it PPC related?
One thing to remember is that there is often a time delay effect as people sign up then they are emailed by the programs and they subsequently deposit a few months down the track. This is where the retention skills of a program come in. And this varies wildly from program to program.
Also smart programs are unlikely to shave you immediately upon signing up. That would be counterproductive - better to let the webmaster get comfortable, send more traffic, then cream the best depositors off the top later down the line. Or they could credit you with the player but make a few deposits disappear later. Or enter a few bogus chargebacks. Or manipulate the stats in other ways. Or they could have bugs in their system and you are shaved through incompetence not malice.
The fundamental problem is that you are sending players into a black hole and you have to trust that the program is being honest and competent with their stats and reporting. There are so many ways you could be shaved that it is impossible to be 100% sure that you are not being shaved by anyone, no matter how good their reputation.
It might suck but the choice you have is to sit at home with your tin foil hat on, or work harder and smarter with the programs with the best reputations and treat shaving like retail treats shoplifting.
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Thanks for all your helpful response. I honestly don't believe I'm being shaved by this operator especially when I've known the AM for many years now.
I'm really just trying to wrap my head around why conversions can differ so much from one casino to the next and I know there are a lot of different factors. I'm going through my growing pains as we speak and doing a lot of split testing to find the answers myself (wish there was a better shortcut).
As of right now, all I can really focus on is sending clicks over to the casino while not using any misleading methods.
