Skybet changes terms to steal from affiliates

[-Shay-]

I'm just removing them from my site's listing. We will let them reach out to us to find out what the problem is. If they do, in the event that they change the terms to something reasonable, they can pay a listing fee to go back up if we decide to work with them again.

[AndyBonus]

Wow, what a bunch of low life's!
They are not easy to convert and are pretty well saturated, so I cant imagine many affiliates able to bring in 6 depositors a month with them. I am not even going to try, so I will be taking them off my new database.

I really hate this trend of big name programs screwing some of us over, because at the end of the day it's not our fault they don't convert. We still send traffic, so we need to keep money coming in.

[wolfie]

As a new and small affiliate on the UK market, there is no reason for me to promote them on these terms. Like others have said, it will be hard for me to even bring in one new depositor per month, let alone six. And 5% is just a disgrace. I can't see anyone except maybe the really big affiliates doing business with them under these terms.
I honestly cannot see why an affiliate programme would want to implement these terms other than reasons of greed, plain stupidity or a combination of both. It will maybe benefit them in the short term but they will lose a lot business in the long term.

I will remove them from my sites. Just glad I can do it now before I invest any more time and effort into promoting their product.

[RacingJim]

Skybet/Casino/Bingo never been one of my better programs anyway, I find them tough to convert to the point that I find it a bit dodgy. Without giving away my figures, I just calculated that Skybet accounted for 0.003% of my total revenue for the last 2 years. Hardly a loss to me.

I am a really good affiliate for some programs and yet will struggle with 6 RMPs per month for these, which says it all really. I question their cookie, their tracking and their tagging/untagging. Clearly a program that has decided that they don't need small-medium affiliates and this is just a land-grab for all the old signups and revenues. Should be illegal but this business is like the wild west.

As I've said before, the companies that don't value their affiliates just need to look at Bet365 - they give their affiliates a fair deal (alongside excellent products and ad campaigns) and lo and behold they are the biggest betting company in the world. Not really hard is it.

[-Shay-]

We received a "similar" email this morning to the one that was originally posted in this thread. Our situation is a bit "different", as we are on a custom deal with Sky.

When I first happened upon this thread - my initial feeling was that these changes "might not" apply to us, given the fact that we did not receive notification, nor did we see a screen prompting us to accept new terms.

The email (in all fairness) "slightly" reduced our negotiated terms. In fact, if I am honest, I could "almost" live with the "new" terms forced upon us.

However... (here's the funny part) --- IF Sky would have approached us BEFORE changing the terms and said something along the lines of "look, given your volume with us, this deal is not working out. We want to keep you, but we need to adjust your deal going forward. You will continue to get what you were promised for the players you already delivered, but with future players, we need to make some changes - how does xx sound?"

...IF that would have happened from Sky THEN Sky most likely would have still be on my network of sites this morning - providing they treated all other affiliates with a similar level of respect.

By the time they got around to sending us an email, they were already removed, as I was in a mood and quickly pulled the trigger. Like I said in my earlier post in this thread - if they rethink this whole process, change direction, and offer some sort of explanation (i.e. - boneheaded thinking from management) & apology to the community, I would consider working with them in the future, but they will pay a listing fee to be relisted.

I do agree that this whole situation is probably not the fault of the affiliate managers - but I hope they are thick skinned enough to understand that their company shat all over the affiliate community in this one.

[PromoteCasino]

By the time they got around to sending us an email, they were already removed, as I was in a mood and quickly pulled the trigger. Like I said in my earlier post in this thread - if they rethink this whole process, change direction, and offer some sort of explanation (i.e. - boneheaded thinking from management) & apology to the community, I would consider working with them in the future, but they will pay a listing fee to be relisted.

Shay,
I take it the next step will be them sending you (and everyone else) an email telling you that they are closing your account for non promotion and that any future commissions due even at 5% will no longer be paid. For a bigger affiliate like yourself that would hurt more than someone like me. But good on you for your principles

[-Shay-]

Shay,
I take it the next step will be them sending you (and everyone else) an email telling you that they are closing your account for non promotion and that any future commissions due even at 5% will no longer be paid. For a bigger affiliate like yourself that would hurt more than someone like me. But good on you for your principles

For 5%, they might as well close it as far as I'm concerned.

Everyone on here does business in their own way - or at least they put their own unique "spin" on the way business is done.

For us, I prefer to think I can't be "bought off". I have enough of an understanding, history, and insight to my market and the quality of my traffic so that I have a pretty good idea about the value of my players (this is not something one would find in any adwords keyword tool). Thus, when we sit down with a company to discuss placement, we have a range that we look for that is worthwhile to us and both fair and worthwhile to the operator. In turn, this puts everyone of "similar offerings" on level ground.

There are some brands that do far better at converting players and some brands that are years ahead in extending the average life (and spend) of a player. And there are a few that blow the roof off the place at doing both.

If all deals for similar operators are within a specific range, and these operators have been vetted to ensure they're of quality character - then that means I can be objective when it comes to placement on my site to the point where I'm doing right by my readers and maximising my profits.

Said another way, everyone is vetted on character before they get a place on our network and the performers are able to perform, as we are rewarding their performance with better placements.

If a deal either falls out of the "range" or if quotas are put in place, or if placement is "bought", I lose my objectivity if I want to get paid - which I am not willing to do. However, in the case of Sky, it didn't even make it that far. When they maliciously changed their terms for the majority, they failed in the character vetting process.

[damage83]

It seems obvious to me that Sky are obviously not getting many new customers. When they had the £10 no deposit offer shed loads of people signed up and I am guessing there is not many more customers out there to gain. Add that to the competition and imo more popular bookmakers like Bet365.

What worries me now is that if someone normally as reliable as skybet can do this then surely the rest will follow suit.

I did get a response from Matt but as expected it was a simple reaffirmation of the previous email and in is words says they are well within their right to enforce this.

[Triple7]

Breaking terms means a single trip to blacklist! Oh wait, they were already because they didn't close affiliate accounts of some hackers that were promoting them on hacked websites.

[Mattbar]

Sky's offers are poor and they are unable to compete with other bookies. Yes they have some decent loyalty promos but they are being left behind in the industry. Lot's of customers are signing up and running back to the likes of 365 because they are simply a better bookie.

let them have their cake and eat it, someone else will come fill the space they vacate as they drop away from lack of promotion by us.

[DanHorvat]

Since I have just been accepted into the program, I can tell you which information are they giving me as a new affiliate.

In the welcome email there is a link "Take a look at our commissions", and when you click, a page with commissions opens up. The main part of it looks like this:





So, no obvious sign of the 5% commission plan. Then I clicked the Terms & Conditions and unlike the Dropbox document crowngate linked to, which says "effective 1 November 2015", my version says "effective 1 November 2014" and there is no mention of the 5% commission plan but there's an asterisk saying the commissions are subject to change:





If I didn't visit this thread on GPWA I'd be perfectly convinced this is a reliable program and that my commission plan is 25%, and that it will be like that for good.

Do they send the notice of a commission change for accounts older than 6 months only when the account gets older than 6 months? Or will they email me on 1 November? Let's wait and see when will I get that email notice.

[adairk]

This is the answer I just received from SkyBettingamd gaming.com

"As stated, for accounts older than 6 months if they send under 6 depositors in a month they will receive 5% commission. I appreciate this isn’t ideal and we will do all we can to support affiliates who wish to achieve their target. However, should you wish to close their account, please let me know."

So I will be letting them know to close my account with them immediately.

[damage83]

Yeah they want us to close our accounts. Really nothing surprises me in this industry. Can not trust anyone.

This is the answer I just received from SkyBettingamd gaming.com

"As stated, for accounts older than 6 months if they send under 6 depositors in a month they will receive 5% commission. I appreciate this isn’t ideal and we will do all we can to support affiliates who wish to achieve their target. However, should you wish to close their account, please let me know."

So I will be letting them know to close my account with them immediately.

[DanHorvat]

So they're waiting to see if I'll generate 6 FTDs per month.

If I'll be doing that, I'll never know about the 5% commission. Until one month I don't deliver 6 FTDs. Then I'll get the notice and a friendly "take it or leave it" proposal - whose goal is to make me close the account so they get all the existing players for free, which is effectively a 0% commission plan.

[PromoteCasino]

So they're waiting to see if I'll generate 6 FTDs per month.

If I'll be doing that, I'll never know about the 5% commission. Until one month I don't deliver 6 FTDs. Then I'll get the notice and a friendly "take it or leave it" proposal - whose goal is to make me close the account so they get all the existing players for free, which is effectively a 0% commission plan.

Won't matter that you may have sent them 100+ FTDs previous 3 months still drop down to 5% for not referring 6 new. Absolute bull*hit.
How long before other firms do the same? I was in two minds but reading this and some of the responses its time for them to go. All I can say it will be there loss

[MattPrice]

Since I have just been accepted into the program, I can tell you which information are they giving me as a new affiliate.

In the welcome email there is a link "Take a look at our commissions", and when you click, a page with commissions opens up. The main part of it looks like this:





So, no obvious sign of the 5% commission plan. Then I clicked the Terms & Conditions and unlike the Dropbox document crowngate linked to, which says "effective 1 November 2015", my version says "effective 1 November 2014" and there is no mention of the 5% commission plan but there's an asterisk saying the commissions are subject to change:





If I didn't visit this thread on GPWA I'd be perfectly convinced this is a reliable program and that my commission plan is 25%, and that it will be like that for good.

Do they send the notice of a commission change for accounts older than 6 months only when the account gets older than 6 months? Or will they email me on 1 November? Let's wait and see when will I get that email notice.

At the risk of putting myself in the firing line - these are all fair points and the areas should have been updated yesterday. I've made adjustments to account for this in our welcome letter, terms and conditions page and commissions page. I will also drop an email to affiliates who were approved in the last two days to outline the changes and make sure they are aware (on Monday). There will also be a follow up to yesterday's email before the start of November. The new terms are also clearly highlighted in our message center for the full month. I have no wish to hide the terms from anyone.

[RacingJim]

By the way I haven't received any email notifying me of these changes either. Good work Skybet.

[JackTenSuited]

By the way I haven't received any email notifying me of these changes either. Good work Skybet.

same here, only a message in the 'message centre' once logged in, but who checks that?

[gaffg]

Can you confirm if these terms being retroactively applied to all affiliates?

At the risk of putting myself in the firing line - these are all fair points and the areas should have been updated yesterday. I've made adjustments to account for this in our welcome letter, terms and conditions page and commissions page. I will also drop an email to affiliates who were approved in the last two days to outline the changes and make sure they are aware (on Monday). There will also be a follow up to yesterday's email before the start of November. The new terms are also clearly highlighted in our message center for the full month. I have no wish to hide the terms from anyone.

[Triple7]

same here, only a message in the 'message centre' once logged in, but who checks that?

I never checked that. Message centres of IA powered programs are anyway useless...