Programs NOT affiliated with EM

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Originally Posted by kwblue

trust AGD's certification. It means something. And Wagerprofits is certified - I will stand behind them 100%.

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Something everyone should consider before severing any business relationships is that most of the programs listed on CAP can not simply walk away as it would be money lost.

If they speak out against CAP, what will happen? CAP will remove them! Thats not in their best interest ... course if they really had a opinion on the matter the lost money might not matter as the statement theyd be making would be worth much more.

I say give it a few months, and if the program you promote renews the certification THEN remove them. If they make that choice, IMO it wouldnt matter who stood behind them as they would be making a conscience choice to support a site which a good portion of the industry considers rogue.

So until then - turn that frown upside down ... :)

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Originally Posted by thepokerkeep

Well Jinnia, that's great to hear. It's awesome that you're in a position to put your morals ahead of your profit margin.

I think you'll be very lonely though, in your attempt and I also think it will be fruitless. In the end, these programs will continue to follow the money and won't be swayed by your actions.

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Being alone is ok with me, but lonely? Never!

Sure business is business, and it is just about the money.
I will do without the money, before I give up soul for it.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Jinnia https://www.gpwa.org/forum/vizion/buttons/viewpost.gif
Yes pokerkeep, removing ALL, whether they are converting or not!!!

I'm waiting to hear the decision of one other, I do good with them, but if they say they decide to keep the seal, they'll be gone!!

It is not about the money, to me!!

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

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Originally Posted by GamTrak

Web definitions for blackmail - exert pressure on someone through threats

Noun

1. blackmail - extortion of money by threats to divulge discrediting information
extortion - the felonious act of extorting money (as by threats of violence)

Verb

1. blackmail - exert pressure on someone through threats
blackjack, pressure

act upon, influence, work - have and exert influence or effect; "The artist's work influenced the young painter"; "She worked on her friends to support the political candidate"

2. blackmail - obtain through threats
crime, criminal offence, criminal offense, law-breaking, offense, offence - (criminal law) an act punishable by law; usually considered an evil act; "a long record of crimes"
extort - obtain through intimidation

source

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Who is influencing who?
Who is threatening who?
Who is working on their friends to support them?

I truly hope everyone has their own mind, and not be influenced by me.

I am doing what "I" believe is right!

It isn't I who practices 'blackmail, threats, intimidation nor extortion.

Jinnia

Can I ask a question??

If you had a reve share from any of these rooms/sites will you continue to take the money from them as you do have a life time rev share deal....


Shaun

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Originally Posted by Jinnia

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Jinnia https://www.gpwa.org/forum/vizion/buttons/viewpost.gif
Yes pokerkeep, removing ALL, whether they are converting or not!!!

I'm waiting to hear the decision of one other, I do good with them, but if they say they decide to keep the seal, they'll be gone!!

It is not about the money, to me!!

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


Who is influencing who?
Who is threatening who?
Who is working on their friends to support them?

I truly hope everyone has their own mind, and not be influenced by me.

I am doing what "I" believe is right!

It isn't I who practices 'blackmail, threats, intimidation nor extortion.

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So now i dont understand.

You trust CAP so you will not work with me, but you do have trust ibn AGD but againyou will still not work with me, i am lost.

I really want to work with every site no matter what size you are big or small 1 player or 10,000 players i dont judge and i never will.

Shaun

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Originally Posted by Jinnia

Yes, I do believe that is my statement in an email after Rachelle contacted me about the Pay No Rake promotion. The 'I apologize" was due to she spent time to have banners made for that promotion.

Don't say I have no trust in AGD, for I do!!

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Originally Posted by wagerprofits

Jinnia

Can I ask a question??

If you had a reve share from any of these rooms/sites will you continue to take the money from them as you do have a life time rev share deal....


Shaun

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Ask me anythang, I'll answer .

When I had my stroke back in Oct. 2007, I sold all my sites, so if any banners are still on these sites, it's due to new owner(s) not removing them.

I have a one regular html site and one board now, no more.

You have my permission to close my account I have.

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Originally Posted by wagerprofits

So now i dont understand.

You trust CAP so you will not work with me, but you do have trust ibn AGD but againyou will still not work with me, i am lost.

I really want to work with every site no matter what size you are big or small 1 player or 10,000 players i dont judge and i never will.

Shaun

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AGD does good work, and as far as we all know, he is honest and trustworthy.

I took somethang to heart when I was told, just this week, "If you patronize a rogue operation, then you are part of the problem".

Shaun, you win some you lose some mate, i wouldn't lose sleep over it.

I don't know you personally but from what others say you are a stand up bloke, even those that take an opposite view to you say that and so i am sure losing some affiliates now wont hurt you in the long run.

In fact i will pop over to your site now and sign up.

So let me get this right if i removed CAP today you would work with me???


Shaun

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Originally Posted by Jinnia

AGD does good work, and as far as we all know, he is honest and trustworthy.

I took somethang to heart when I was told, just this week, "If you patronize a rogue operation, then you are part of the problem".

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Although I have not worked closely with Shaun yet, I have worked with Wager Profits for many years, and most of the affiliates that have been around very long know that they are one of the good guys....

I personally feel this is where this whole "let's rogue CAP" stuff has been getting out of hand.

If Wager Profits decides to continue to work with CAP, that has to be their decision, and should not reflect badly on me if I continue to work with Wager Profits.

It should not necessarily reflect badly on Shaun or the Wager Profits organization if they continue to do so either...

Rick
Universal4

Really, why do you keep asking me these questions?

I feel WP won't remove that seal, or any other paid for seal.

You are a business, I understand that, and you'll go to where you are, or feel you are getting affiliates to promote you and players to deposit at the
brands you carry.

I am not roguing your business, or saying it's is a rogue. I am just choosing not to promote WP and your brands. It's my personal choice.

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Originally Posted by universal4

Although I have not worked closely with Shaun yet, I have worked with Wager Profits for many years, and most of the affiliates that have been around very long know that they are one of the good guys....

I personally feel this is where this whole "let's rogue CAP" stuff has been getting out of hand.

If Wager Profits decides to continue to work with CAP, that has to be their decision, and should not reflect badly on me if I continue to work with Wager Profits.

It should not necessarily reflect badly on Shaun or the Wager Profits organization if they continue to do so either...

Rick
Universal4

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And I agree with you Universal. Just like if I decide not to promote
an affiliate program or a casino, that is my decision also!

Correct Jinnia, I was NOT singling you out....

Let's NOT lose sight of what we are upset about...

Many felt there is/was a potential conflict of interest with EM working too closely with affiliate programs and also working too closely with CAP and sharing some common ownership between the companies...

Then with the seal program, another potential layer of conflict can exist.

This thread in it's original intention was not to discuss those conflicts as much as it was a call to programs to state that they in fact were/were not connected to EM in any way....but it seems any thread can easily degrade into anti-cap in the blink of an eye lately.

I for one would very much like to see threads get back on track, there are plenty of threads in exisitience that cover numerous discussions that they should not all end up so.....

Rick
Universal4

Jinnia you said

"Ask me anythang, I'll answer."

Hence the reason i did, please dont think i am having a pop at you i am just trying to understand.

By roguing CAP you are in a way roguing anybody that works with them.

So my questions still stand lets say I did remove the CAP seal (that yes I did pay for) would you work with Wager Profits and me???

Shaun

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Originally Posted by Jinnia

Really, why do you keep asking me these questions?

I feel WP won't remove that seal, or any other paid for seal.

You are a business, I understand that, and you'll go to where you are, or feel you are getting affiliates to promote you and players to deposit at the
brands you carry.

I am not roguing your business, or saying it's is a rogue. I am just choosing not to promote WP and your brands. It's my personal choice.

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By roguing CAP you are in a way roguing anybody that works with them.

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Not really. It's more of a personal choice as Jinnia said. I realize everyone is tired of this whole thing but it is now up to us to do what we can to clean things up for new affiliates etc. Everyone is free to do what the choose with the information given us by APCW and GPWA and others.

Jinnia has chosen not to use what she doesn't feel is appropriate under the circumstances. Myself, I have chosen to write and article so that maybe just one person who reads it may be saved some grief.

http://gamblingmojo.com/casino_affil...ograms_cap.htm

It would be nice to have this all go away but it won't. Nor should it. More new affilites come around every day and need to be informed. We should not just say 'oh well' and move on. This will never die until CAP comes clean.

JMO

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Originally Posted by mojo

Not really. It's more of a personal choice as Jinnia said. I realize everyone is tired of this whole thing but it is now up to us to do what we can to clean things up for new affiliates etc. Everyone is free to do what the choose with the information given us by APCW and GPWA and others.

Jinnia has chosen not to use what she doesn't feel is appropriate under the circumstances. Myself, I have chosen to write and article so that maybe just one person who reads it may be saved some grief.

http://gamblingmojo.com/casino_affil...ograms_cap.htm

It would be nice to have this all go away but it won't. Nor should it. More new affilites come around every day and need to be informed. We should not just say 'oh well' and move on. This will never die until CAP comes clean.

JMO

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Mojo i do agree with you on one aspect of your comments if i think about it and that is that by roguing CAP that does not follow that you are roguing any site that is associated with them, personally i dont see that connection

But Jinnia is withdrawing from Wagerprofits because they are certified by CAP, this she has made clear here, so in effect she is roguing wagerprofits because of CAP, yes its her personal choice and that is of course her perogative.

But if you read the contents of the email earlier in this thread that personal choice was brought about by wagerprofits certification, no other reason and therefore that is an action that in effects rogues wagerprofits

which to me has now taken all this too far now, well in this case anyway.

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Originally Posted by Betpartners

But Jinnia is withdrawing from Wagerprofits because they are certified by CAP, this she has made clear here, so in effect she is roguing wagerprofits because of CAP, yes its her personal choice and that is of course her perogative.

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Sorry, I think you've got it a bit wrong Betpartners - (Jinnia can correct me if I am wrong) ...

Jinnia is NOT withdrawing from Wagerprofits because of CAP - shes withdrawing because WagerProfits(Shaun) has stated that THEY(he) will continue to fully support CAP regardless of any history of wrong-doings.

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But Jinnia is withdrawing from Wagerprofits because they are certified by CAP, this she has made clear here, so in effect she is roguing wagerprofits because of CAP, yes its her personal choice and that is of course her perogative.

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Unfortunatly, we may be seeing more of that. Jinnia is simply excercising her right to step up to the plate and say no more. Caring affiliates feel a responsibility to do everything in their power to make things right for the next generation. I simply cannot find any fault with that. In fact, it is a very difficult thing to do. Do you stop working with good programs for the greater good even though it may hurt your bottom line? I admit I am not ready to go there yet.

I think that affiliates would like to see affiliate programs step up and say 'no more' as well. Doing nothing is not an option for some of us.

arkyt not according to this statement

"I just noticed you carry the CAP seal at Wager Profits, so I can not promote any of your brands. I do apologize!!"

That to me looks like its because they carry the seal, in addition Shaun has asked Jinnia twice if she would still work with wagerprofits if he removed the seal.

It was because they carried the seal

Again Jinnia is free to do as she wishes and so is Mojo, yourself and me, but this action seems way over the top.

Someone posted a list of sites that carry the CAP seal, it is quite extensive, anyone going down that road and removing all their programs is making a very big decision, something the vast majority simply wont take, why should they.

Thats like saying some of the worlds biggest gambling brands are rogues by association, sorry to me that does not make no sense whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by mojo

Unfortunatly, we may be seeing more of that. Jinnia is simply excercising her right to step up to the plate and say no more. Caring affiliates feel a responsibility to do everything in their power to make things right for the next generation. I simply cannot find any fault with that. In fact, it is a very difficult thing to do. Do you stop working with good programs for the greater good even though it may hurt your bottom line? I admit I am not ready to go there yet.

I think that affiliates would like to see affiliate programs step up and say 'no more' as well. Doing nothing is not an option for some of us.

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Stepping up to the plate is very subjective and also your following comment

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Caring affiliates feel a responsibility to do everything in their power to make things right for the next generation.

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leads me to ask for some form of clarification

Does that mean that those that continue to carry the CAP seal or work with them are uncaring affiliates?

Actually don't answer that, probably best not to

But the damage this is doing looks like it is now going beyond just CAP but bleeding down in to the industry as a whole

Now that is a shame and begs the question is it all worth it