(This interview was originally published in the July 2017 issue of the GPWA Times Magazine.)
Name: Neil
Age: 36
Hometown: Caerphilly, Wales
Living in: Cape Town, South Africa
Favorite Food: Burgers
Must-Read Book: Rework by Jason Fried
Name: Imre
Age: 33
Hometown: Debrecen, Hungary
Living in: Southern Spain
Favorite Food: Beer
Must-Read Book: Rings of Truth by Jim Britt
Site:
VegasHero.co
How did each of you first get into the iGaming business? What did you do before?
IMRE: I moved to sunny Spain, near Gibraltar, for the good weather after living for five years in the rainy northeast of England. I knew there were plenty of jobs available in web design and development in the iGaming industry here. My first job was a webmaster role at a large white-label gambling company, where I met Neil. Prior to this I was a freelance web consultant, and I worked in IT as well for a couple of years.
NEIL: I came all the way from South Africa to live in Spain, was hired as a senior web designer at the same gambling company. Prior to this I had worked in a web agency and other industries as a designer and front-end dev.
When and how did you two end up deciding to go into business with each other? Why do you think you work well together?
IMRE: I met Neil at a job in Gibraltar. We were on the same web team and we quickly realized we made a good team. We had totally different skill sets and complemented each other's shortcomings well. I learned a lot from Neil about design and coding. He is a starter (the “spark”); I’m the finisher (the “operations”) guy. We are both constant work horses – our minds never rest. Always thinking about the next idea while working mad hours on the current project. I think we are great accountability partners as well – we keep motivating each other and don't let things get left off even when it’s hard to see a project “making it.”
NEIL: As Imre said, it was a great fit. I’m the guy with ants in his pants, and Imre’s is more level-headed! We are very compatible when it comes to skill sets, and the partnership is great. We also share a passion for entrepreneurship. Our first project together was a WordPress theme!
Before you started vegashero.co, you had an affiliate site, slotsmarvel.com. When did you start this site? How long did it take for you to start making money with it?
IMRE: Yes, initially I started this site as a hobby and to learn about the affiliate side of the industry, around four years ago. I did a lot of
SEO and ranked the site for very specific game keywords. Then Neil came on board and redesigned the site to make it look competitive. I think it was a full year without seeing a single penny coming in. We nearly gave up. Then after one successful December, when we received the first $1,000 commission, we started to see this little niche could get us somewhere. I had had affiliate sites, in the past but they were not gambling-related.
NEIL: We’d always talked about having an affiliate site, but we never had the niche to do it. Imre came to me one day and asked if I’d like to partner. At the time, my
SEO experience was terrible, but after a million questions and seeing the results for myself I became hooked. After trying many methods, concepts and ideas, we learned what worked and what didn’t very quickly.
Slotsmarvel.com focused specifically on slot games with Marvel Comics themes. What drew you to such a specific theme?
IMRE: I am quite a superhero movie nut. You can often see me on the beach walking my dog in goofy Marvel and DC character t-shirts. It was a topic that I was interested in, and I thought the Playtech Marvel slots series were good interpretations.
NEIL: I love Marvel, and when we started getting commissions from the site, I loved Marvel even more!
Tell us a little more about vegashero.co.
IMRE: We wanted to add 200+ demo games to our affiliate site once to extend the content and game keywords we covered. It turned out to be a time-consuming task – it took us weeks to collect the images and iframe codes and to add affiliate links – so the idea to streamline this via a plugin came to us, and we started working on a product that you now know as the VegasHero Affiliate Plugin. We used it ourselves first, then we made it available for sale to other affiliates. The idea had to be explained to affiliates for a while, and it took a couple of months of refinements to make the plugin easy to use and to cater to the audience with the right features. We networked and talked to probably 300+ affiliates up till today who constantly provide us with feedback, so we know what functionality our plugins and themes should have in the next version.
NEIL: As Imre said, it was a total pain to add just 10 games to the site. For me, it was a new experience, and I thought to myself, “This can’t be the way to source iframe URLs!” What Imre supplied me with from an operator was mind-blowing – most of the URLs didn’t work!
So one day after having coffee (and a few beers) on the Costa del Sol, we started to bounce the idea around and it grew into the basic idea. The third partner in this venture is a friend of mine in South Africa; I pitched the idea and he had a bigger idea of how we could manage and distribute the massive number of games. What we created was far better than what we imagined. Thanks to the GPWA for allowing us to ask potential customers about the idea – the feedback was mixed, but we felt confident enough to take the plunge, and after we launched we marketed the plugin on the forum.
Do you run vegashero.co full-time or part-time?
IMRE: Part-time. I have other WordPress-related businesses as well, and work freelance occasionally for website, development, and
SEO projects as a consultant.
NEIL: I’m also part-time. I have a full-time job and another two business ventures in which I share a partnership. Juggling this and having a family is a challenge, but I believe you can chip your way to success.
Do you have employees, or do you run your site by yourselves?
IMRE: It’s me; Neil, who is responsible for the products; and a senior developer, Charlie, who writes amazing backend code. We work with a freelance writer who specializes in gaming content, as well.
Do you have plans for additional sites, either for products and services for affiliates, or running another affiliate site yourselves?
IMRE: We are planning to make more WordPress themes for the iGaming industry – to cover sportsbook, poker, bingo. It’s not unlikely that we start more affiliate sites ourselves too, but at this moment in time we are focused on WordPress products. We have many connections and a lot of experience to leverage to get a new site up and running fast, so this can happen if we find a niche we could relate to.
NEIL: We just recently branched out into making themes. I’ve always been passionate about doing this. The design I did two years ago was challenging, and coding it was even more challenging, but we wanted specific things for affiliates – being an affiliate and dealing with a normal WordPress theme, especially as a starter, is very time consuming. Between the theme and plugin, you can cut your build time significantly. I have some ideas for other WordPress gambling themes that I would like to design and build.
What makes your site unique? How do you help it stand out from the competition?
IMRE: There are only a handful of WordPress theme and plugin providers for this specific market, and most of them are very outdated in terms of design. We think our WordPress themes can create a slick look for any affiliate site, and the VegasHero affiliate plugin boasting 1,600+ demo games is a totally unique offering right now. There is no similar product available at the moment that can add such a selection of demo slots in a couple of clicks.
NEIL: From a design point of view I stay on top of things; you can see this from the design of our site. I update every year or two as soon as I see things looking dated. I’m just pedantic about it.
Our products are always going to stay one step ahead; the technology behind our distribution is fantastic. Customers won’t get better – we can guarantee it!
How do you decide what games and brands to promote?
IMRE: The providers are often requested by our customers. We try to integrate with the major providers first, and occasionally the providers themselves approach us for a partnership.
How is working with affiliates as your customers different from having players?
IMRE: It is very different. As an affiliate marketer, we very rarely had contact with the actual casino players. As a product owner who serves affiliates with software solutions, you are faced with very demanding customers. The quality of the products and support needs to be top notch – after all, they purchase VegasHero products to make money with them.
Do you gamble?
IMRE: Not really. I understand who wins at the end of the day, and I like to be on the profitable side.
NEIL: I don’t, either. I do on the live slot machines, but I’m not heavy into it.
How often do you get to see and interact with other people in the industry?
IMRE: I’m in daily contact with affiliates via Skype and e-mail, and have been to a couple of conferences like AAC and BAC where I met some of the online contacts face to face.
What traits do you look for in an affiliate manager? How about in an affiliate program?
IMRE: I appreciate integrity and timely responses. An affiliate program should have proactive communication about changes, prompt and precise payments, and up-to-date technical possibilities for linking, tracking and reporting.
What's your preferred method of communication with affiliate managers?
IMRE: E-mail and Skype.
What prompted you to join the GPWA? How has it helped you?
IMRE: It's a great place to network and to read about current events in gambling. It helped me reach out to fellow affiliates when we needed advice and feedback about our products.
NEIL: It’s the best place for me to source knowledge on questions gambling-related. The GPWA community is great; I rarely see conflict.
What do you like about the industry?
IMRE: The best thing about it is that I get to meet people with a similar mindset to mine. There are many web entrepreneurs working as affiliates who are working their butts off to get the time and financial freedom that can ultimately liberate one from the 9-to-5 rat race.
NEIL: For me, I love the opportunity. It’s still a fairly new industry – online specifically – and what we can bring to it makes it exciting.
If you could change one thing about the industry, what would it be and why?
IMRE: Wipe away georestrictions and local regulatory rules – they can create a lot of difficulty and complications.
NEIL: I agree with Imre. If it was open, we would see more affiliates coming in.
What do you think the industry will look like in five years?
IMRE: It will be bigger than ever, with more and more people playing on all sorts of devices.
NEIL: Of course mobile, but I think companies are going to get smarter with cross-selling.
What do your family and friends think of your work as an affiliate?
IMRE: My family understands very little of it – they are quite non-technical. Friends usually think it’s cool to work online on your own terms and are very supportive.
NEIL: It’s the same with me, they don’t know that there’s another world out there.
How do you manage your to-do lists? Do you use any special software to help you out?
IMRE: We use Basecamp for most projects and for collaborative work. For daily quick to-dos, I currently like the Momentum Chrome extension’s to-do list; it’s quite neat. I recommend everyone to try it if you haven’t.
How much time do you devote social networking for your site?
IMRE: Maybe just a couple of minutes per day. Our main game is
SEO.
What's the most difficult thing about running your site?
IMRE: Keeping the games database up-to-date, and maximizing our product compatibility with the plethora of hosting server solutions people use.
What's the best thing about running your site?
IMRE: Time and location independency. Meeting and talking to like-minded people.
NEIL: Same for me – the freedom to answer queries, design or develop wherever I want.
What do you do to stay in shape – both physically and mentally?
IMRE: Listening to a lot of podcasts in a wide range of topics following top performers of each field I am interested in. I love to learn each day and apply what I learned to my personal situation. For good health, I try to eat good food and go for a training class two to three times a week and spend at least two hours a day outside, away from the computer.
NEIL: I train in Brazilian jiujitsu, keeps me fit and humble! I listen to podcasts often, too.
What do you do with your spare time?
IMRE: Travel, eat, drink, do some fishing, chill on the beach with a frosty beer. All in all, spend quality time with my daughter and wife, and the family dog.
NEIL: Family, designing and developing. I like to work when I have spare time. Other than that I like to braai (BBQ) and enjoy Cape Town.
What did you dream of doing, both professionally and personally, when you were a kid?
IMRE: I used to play a lot of basketball as a kid and I guess wanted to do that for a while, but then I stopped growing taller and kind of realized maybe this is not going to happen.
NEIL: I am an artist – I used to paint portraits and I have the potential to be great, but it didn’t pay the bills so I’ve always wanted business ventures.
If someone from out of town were visiting you, what’s the one place you'd definitely take them to see?
IMRE: The beach.
NEIL: The Waterfront. It’s a great place to spend the day, with the best food South Africa has to offer.
When you need to get as far away from work as possible, where do you go?
IMRE: Probably back to my hometown in Hungary. Although I am only as far away from work as the closest internet connection, no matter where I am.
NEIL: Good question – it’s rare to get away, but when I do, I try out new places in Cape Town to explore.
What's your all-time favorite movie?
IMRE: Probably Face-Off from the classic action movies. But I have many current favorites too, mostly from the Marvel Universe.
NEIL: I'm a fan of Guy Richie films. Snatch has to be my all-time favorite.
If you could invite any five people, living or dead, to dinner, who would they be?
IMRE: Tony Robbins, Elon Musk, Nikola Tesla, Tim Ferriss and James Hetfield.
Name three things that people reading this magazine don't know about you.
IMRE: 1. Although I am Hungarian, I can’t stand the smell of pálinka, the national drink in Hungary.
2. According to some people, I have freakishly long eyelashes for a man.
3. I’ve never been to Vegas.
NEIL: 1. I’ve spent half my life between South Africa and Wales, and I don’t speak either language.
2. I love classic German cars.
3. I’m a bit of a programming geek.