Affiliate Interview Series - Tony Mace

[GPWA Daniel]

(This interview was originally published in the February 2019 issue of the GPWA Times Magazine)


How long have you been in the iGaming business? How did you first get into the industry?
I’ve been in the industry since 2002, but did have a three-year break starting in 2014. The break was pretty much to focus on some property development projects and get some fresh air for a change.

I got started in the business after being amazed by partypoker and just deciding "This is gonna be big!" I focused mainly on poker back then and did quite well, evolving as things moved on and building what I would class as my first proper site in 2005. Before building that main and very popular affiliate site, the stuff I put online was pretty much the same as many others around that time. The process was simple:
• Exact match domain name.
• Keyword-stuffed content.
• Flashing banners everywhere.

But it worked, so I can’t complain.

What did you do before iGaming? What did you learn that has helped you as an affiliate?
I have always run businesses since the age of 18. But from the age of 11, I did two paper rounds before school, a fruit and veg round with the local farmer and anything else I could do to make money.

I was an apprentice builder at 16 and left at 18 to do something for myself. I’ve had multiple businesses since then and enjoyed them all.

Tell us about your sites. When did you launch your first site? How long did it take for it to start making money?
I actually came back to the industry in late 2017, so my sites at the moment are all very new. In the past nine months I have built and sold around 13 sites based on sports, casino and bingo, all with amazing rankings and decent revenue for the new owners.

That’s one of my massive faults and always has been: I get bored very easily. I really enjoy starting new things, and websites are no different. Once it starts to work and the sites start getting traffic and revenue, I start to get bored and want to do it all over again.

I am trying very hard at the moment to keep at least one site in my portfolio and to keep my boredom in line. I am planning to keep building and selling what I would call starter sites for new affiliates to help them hit the ground running.

One of your sites is focused on sportsbooks. What's one thing you think an affiliate new to the sportsbook market should know about it?
Speaking from a U.K. perspective, new affiliates have to do something different, because it’s a lot harder than it ever was and isn’t getting any easier. Keep up to date with everything, because with all the changes, it’s super important to keep focused and not be tempted to cross the line – especially where legislation is concerned.

It’s competitive, and don’t expect to make any money for 12 to 18 months. Determination is key, but listen to others who have been around a lot longer. They have made all the mistakes you are about to make, learned the lessons you have yet to learn, and will help you.

Be appreciative, and you’ll have so much knowledge to draw upon. You’ll save a lot of time, money and frustration.

How has the online sportsbook market changed since you started your site? Do you anticipate trying to take advantage of the new regulated markets in the U.S.?
The biggest change is the lack of good sportsbooks for affiliates to choose from. From a U.K. perspective it’s pretty dire and a sad situation when we can’t totally trust the big brands. I am currently looking into the U.S. market and trying to find a gap to fill.

Sports betting can be a tough sector, especially when players are doing well. How volatile are your revenues from month to month?
I’ve found that the money specifically from sports bettors isn’t great. What I have learned over all these years, however, is to target the customers who are more “gamblers” by appealing to their kind of bets. This works very well as they tend to also play a lot of casino games, so the revenue stream is better and not as volatile.

One of your sites is focused on bingo, and another on casinos. What vertical do you like best, and why?
I like promoting casinos best, because the income is always going to be higher. Bingo is a lot easier, but the rewards just aren’t as good – and everything deserves the same effort, so it would be nice if the rewards were the same.

Do you have plans for additional sites?
The only thing I’m actually planning and not just stumbling upon at the moment is a site for affiliates. I want to open an online store selling themes, ready-made content and small sites I have built to give people a good start in the industry.

I’d expect this to launch in early 2019, as work has already begun to quite some extent.

What makes your sites unique? How do you help them stand out from the competition?
I always try to do something different. If you take lucky15calculator.co.uk as an example, it’s very simple, but it gives users exactly what they want. Answering questions and inquiries that users search for and providing useful tools is always the way to go. It creates interaction, gets you valuable links and keeps people coming back.

How do you decide what operators to promote?
I like operators that offer something a little different, or that can create custom welcome offers and landing pages. This means we can target specific users for specific bet types and be unique.
I don’t care what anyone else says, the deciding factor is money. This is a business, after all. That said, however, they need to fit these five criteria for me to list them:
1. Answer quickly.
2. Be flexible with custom landing pages and promotions.
3. Be established and not rogue, or you’re paying up front!
4. If new, pay up front or it’s a no from me (unless I get a good feeling).
5. Be polite and professional, and don't demand positions.

Are you a full-time or part-time affiliate? Do you have employees, or do you run your sites by yourself?
I’m more than full-time, I guess, as many are. It’s not uncommon to do 16 to 18 hours a day when I’m in the mood.

No employees anymore, as they are hard work and stress-free is easier. Freelancers are excellent if you can get good ones, and when you do they are worth their weight in gold.

Do you gamble online? What about in brick-and-mortar casinos?
Sometimes I do, but not much nowadays. I did play poker professionally for a while back from 2004 to 2007, both online and in live tournaments. I was a well-known poker player, most profitable in limit Hold’em at $20/40 and $30/$60. That’s kind of my claim to fame. I like to slip it into conversations now and then, just like I did there.

How often do you get to see and interact with other people in the industry? Have you attended any conferences?
I speak every day on Skype to a lot of fellow affiliates and affiliate managers. I have never been to a conference and I'm not sure it appeals to me that much. I know I should, and it’s likely I will at some point – but drinking and deal-making aren’t compatible, in my opinion, and that’s the feedback I get from others who attend. A headache doesn’t help anyone!

What traits do you look for in an affiliate manager? How about in an affiliate program?
Quick and clear communication, and payments on time.

Any problems, just let me know.

What prompted you to join the GPWA? How has it helped you?
I joined the GPWA because there was something for sale I wanted. I’ve bought a few things from the forum, from sites to content, so it’s been a great resource. I also sell some of the starter sites I’ve mentioned and some domains there.
There are some useful SEO posts, and the members are educated and can offer some excellent help and advice.

What do you like about the industry?
Because I get bored so easily, the ability to build new sites whenever I feel like it keeps me entertained. Because I enjoy new challenges, it suits me completely, and depending on what mood I’m in often dictates what I do each day.

If you could change one thing about the industry, what would it be and why?
Just make everything clearer from the start. The deals we make with affiliate programs have a history of not lasting. This doesn’t exactly fill anyone with confidence when making a commitment to promote a certain brand.

What do you think the industry will look like in five years?
Affiliate programs, in my opinion, will continue to close and we will lose out.
I’m not sure if it will happen within five years, but I think it’s on the horizon.
The only way to combat this is to build the very best sites with amazing content. This way the site can earn from other avenues, such as Google AdSense, which I expect to be the way the industry goes.

This isn’t meant to sound gloomy or the end of the world for us as affiliates, but it’s just something I think will happen.
Not every affiliate program will close, of course, but choices will be more limited, just as they are now compared to five years ago.

What do your family and friends think of your work as an affiliate?
Most have literally no idea what I do. You can explain it over and over, and people just don’t get it. Those who do think it’s pretty cool, though, and show a real interest.

What's your approach to SEO and drawing traffic to your site? How much time do you spend on SEO specifically?
In all honesty, I devote very little time to this. Perhaps one day a month I’ll do some link-building and e-mails to try a few different tactics. I am a very firm believer in everything working if you just provide exactly what the user is looking for.

That said, on-page SEO is done every day. As new articles go up, they have to be complete and include internal linking strategies and so on.

How much time do you devote to social networking for your sites?
None. This is another big flaw of mine. I actually hate social media, but know at some point I’ll have to bite the bullet and get to work on it.

What's the most difficult thing about running your sites?
There is genuinely nothing difficult about it, in my opinion. Just get up, get started, and do what you need to do and more. Over time you’ll meet good people and make some great friends. Helping one another makes the business both more enjoyable and easier to improve at.

What's the best thing about running your sites?
Flexibility. I could run them from anywhere, as we all could. There aren’t that many businesses you can do that with and still have complete control.

What do you do to stay in shape – both physically and mentally?
"Most definitely not enough" is the answer to this. It’s on my to-do list to get more active and take more time off, but I never seem to get around to it.

Walking the dogs is about the only exercise I get nowadays, which isn’t enough.

What do you do with your spare time?
I don’t have any, and that’s the truth! Spending time with family is important to me, so I need to make more time for that. Watching a good film or going for a walk with the dogs is all I need.

If you won $10 million playing the lottery tomorrow, what would you do?
I’d freak out. I must be the luckiest man alive, because I don’t play the lottery! If I did, however, I would do nothing for a while and just go away for a few weeks to have a think before making stupid, rash decisions.

What were you like in high school?
An absolute nightmare for teachers and other students. The problem I had was if I wasn’t interested in the subject or I already knew it, then I was bored out of my brain and just started messing around and distracting others.

On the other hand, some lessons I found intriguing and excelled at.

If someone from out of town were visiting you, what’s the one place you'd definitely take them to see?
A balloon ride over the lakes we have here is pretty amazing. It depends on the weather, since unfortunately it rains a lot!

When you need to get as far away from work as possible, where do you go?
Right outside my door is the Lake District National Park. It’s now a World Heritage site and is pretty breathtaking. I do feel lucky to live somewhere so beautiful, but often take it for granted.

That, or I go out to see and chat to the horses. It just helps take my mind off work completely, which is a very rare thing.

What are your pet peeves?
Laziness. There really is no excuse for being lazy. If something needs to get done, do it.

If you could invite any five people, living or dead, to dinner, who would they be?
I’ve got five kids, so that fits perfectly. Nothing is more important than them, and any excuse to get the older ones back from university is a good one for me.

Name three things that people reading this magazine don't know about you.
1: My favorite film is The Greatest Showman.
2: The music from Lord of the Dance motivates me.
3: I get obsessed with work – love it, live for it and need to take more time off.

[Cash Bonus]

An interesting affiliate interview series and some of your questions have made me think of re-evaluating the way that I see things in our industry. I like the way you've answered question 18. There's no doubt that our industry is struggling as many casino operators have closed shop, leaving many employees, players and affiliates in the dark and this has sadly been happening a lot lately. Good on you for taking the time and putting in the effort to do this for GPWA.