Anyone been paid this month?

[dkaltci]

They have also closed my affiliate account for inactivity. No warning...nothing.

I was owed $1200 from March and they have paid me $120.

Their T&C which they refer to state:



So they should be paying me at the rate of 10% revenue share rather than 10% of the commission that was earned? Or have I misunderstood that?

I also have a account that I was not checked a long time ago. Now when I am checking it I see that I have net revenue for March of around 1400 $. My commission for March is 280 $ and they have payd me 28 $... Obviously they are payng 10% of the commission, and not 10 % of the net revenue share as stated in the terms and conditions. This is so wrong...

[-Shay-]

I also have a account that I was not checked a long time ago. Now when I am checking it I see that I have net revenue for March of around 1400 $. My commission for March is 280 $ and they have payd me 28 $... Obviously they are payng 10% of the commission, and not 10 % of the net revenue share as stated in the terms and conditions. This is so wrong...

Income Access software error or thievery? Either way, unacceptable.

[Silizio]

1. Can anyone explain,what this inactivity rule means? How many new customers i have to bring every month etc.?
2. Do they have at time stats problems? I had some active users and my revenue says 0

[mickyfu]

My stats have seriosly changed not to 10% though, and stats for this month are now showing 0. Not sure if this is an issue or not. All I can say is if I am not paid what my stats originally showed, I will be removing all BetFred promos from my sites. Since BetFred went to Active Wins it has been a joke.

[jvtelemark]

I see now that I am not the only small affiliate in the very same position. And for around a week I have been fighting as a maniac to explain to Active Wins how the situation is.

As a loyal affiliate over far more than 5 years I actually had expected to be treated better than this. Since I work as a small affiliate I have had periods with different affiliates with no signups, no activity and no Revenue. And since my forum isnt exactly the blooming company it was up to 2 or 3 years ago. And I accept the fact that it probably ever will be like that again. First of all because I simply dont have the time to work 24/7 with a small pokersite. Secondly because the intense love of poker has been fading to a more practical view.

So the last couple of years I have received 3-4 mails from the serious partners with the question: Are you promoting us? Since we havent seen any new players or depositors the last year or months we are considering to break up the deal.!

Fair enough, a contract is a contract. And so is respect. I always answer: Well, I see that I have XXX dollars in yearly Revenue, but the last few years I havent been able to do so much work with you as I wished. Unfortunately I cant guarantee this will change in the next few years. But I do speak to some of the players you have, and I always make sure they now about your latest offers. The 2 sites With a small Revenue for a few dollars monthly both said: Its cool...And I managed to maintain our partnership.

Betfred has been one of my prime sites ever since I started my first forum over 7 years ago. And during these 7 years I have spent thousands of hours to run this forum. I ABSOLUTELY HATE IT, but it is still a thing I do with the deepest love and affection. It took me 10 months of running the forum to realize that I never would be rich, and since then it has only been a question of making a community for players similar to myself.

Betfred was one of my first sites I negotiated that actually shared some of my ideas. And after a great deal of negotiations we were allowed to host some few freerolls and tournaments. There were 2-3 other sites aswell that I worked rather tight with, and my little forum with only a few members suddenly was one of the better pokercommunities. And my Betfred link was hot for a couple of months. There were only ONE problem: The Income. the first couple of years I was struggling for months to receive a payment. And when I FINALLY received the first payment I immediately contacted Betfred: Can we do something again? I offered to pay my own tournaments...dont know exactly who paid for it. But I spent ALL my Income at Betfred.

The business were still slow, but a few dollars here and there adds up...And since I really LIKED Betfred I DID IT ALL AGAIN.

It was time to open my eyes after this. For pokerplayers there are a few other sites that I would rather recommend, but I turned most of them down. Primarily because I run a lowroller-forum, and I believe in promotions that are good for small time players. Why offer 60% rakeback for players raking 10000€ plus if my players are raking 100€? And Betfred were fair and great. And I STILL believe Betfred is a site that I can easily recommend to a small player...my kind of players.

So we are going forward to the end of 2013. For a few years I sent out a mailer now and again with some offers including Betfred offers. Was hosting a tournament now and again. Nothing on Betfred for a year or two. And there were no new depositors or downloaders for a couple of years. Fair enough..if Betfred had sent me a mailer with the word like some of the others it would actually have been fair!

Then Things actually changed a bit. First of all because I had a single Casino-player started to play at Betfred. But also because a few of my members started to play there. The Casino-player stood for 99% of the Income, but you could definately see that Betfred was one of the "talking" sites at my chat. And I know that at least 5 players played at Betfred regularly...unfortunately none of them via my affiliate-link, but thats cool. The last 6 months the Revenue finally has been satisfactory.

So in late March I contacted the New affiliate-owners Active Wins in order to talk about a kinda original request. I wanted to "buy" tournament tickets. Once or twice a year I am hosting a QUIZ at my chat and of course we need prizes. This is always fun, and strengthen the good community. It cost me some Money, but the traffic is more important right?

The affiliate Manager didnt quite respond, but that is absolutely OK. I send out some request now and again just to keep the communty active.

And since I were to experience my biggest Betfred payday 480$ in March I spent those dollars on another thing.

In April were it seems like "everyone" has experienced some problems my net Income were 160$. In the end of April I contacted Active Wins to claim a missing payment for the 480$.

The answer I received was SHOCKING. 1st of May I received a mail: Since you havent brought us any customers the last 6 months we are terminating the affiliate contract. WHAT THE F**K? Is that a way to treat loyal affiliates? A deal that FINALLY has been paying off for both parts the last few months? Three hours later I wasnt even able to log in.

At first I thought a mail or two would "solve" the matter. Well, trust me it didnt? Their response were: We can host some exclusive tournaments for you, and then we can see how Things are working out. As an affiliate that actually knows my members I can honestly say: It would not have meant a difference. Of course I have a few ideas, and I will be more than happy to present them shortly.

And during the back and forth mails I realised: MAYBE, just MAYBE it is actually time to go separate ways. Despite of the fact that I am actually receiving regular Income.

Im really not that keen on promoting sites with bad reputation, so I was actually willing to cancel the whole deal...even though this seriously are benefitting this cheaters.

However, when a contract is terminated on May 1st, how on earth should that affect the March payment that should have been paid out way before the termination? I DO NOT ACCEPT THAT. I read in the T&C that you are paying out 10% revshare. And then I see from the last posts that you are actually paying 10 percent of the payout...Why? That actually means 2.5% revshare. So not only are you cheating us loyal affiliates, but also on the dollars you should have paid. Thats cheating...and I DONT LIKE CHEATERS

In clause 6.7 in Your T&C it says: Affiliates shall receive their payment within 30 days. And since Active Wins appaerently uses that T&C to get out of a contract with jvtelemark1 you better follow the Whole deal, instead of that one rule that benefits ActiveWins.

I am furious, and since there seems to be more affiliates in the same boat, I can guarantee that I am not finished to rock the boat. For around a week I have discussed this matter seriously both with Active Wins Aff Manager Ryan Levene, as well as IACorey here on GPWA.

Although IACorey stands up to be a really Nice guy: I spoke to the manager of the affiliate team and was informed that you should be contacted again today by Ryan if you have not already. I hope something can be worked out this, you seem that you would be a lot of fun to work with.

But they still havent recognised that I actually have a "legal" claim. I have respected (I dont like it, but I have numerous of times said I Accept it) to cancel the affiliate deal. I will not recommend Active Wins to anyone, I will InFact tell you to stay the h**l out. Its a cheat, and they cheat you as soon as they have a chance of them to do it.

I have tried to suggest a compromise, where I receive 480$ on the March Income, and I give up everything from April and the rest of the future. I am NOT the part that has been unreasonable. I have given a few deadlines for this issue, but now it is time to publicly warn the affiliate-community to this robbery.

I am of course not done, I still feel I have a few aces up my hands yet.

Feel free to send me a PM if you are in the same position as me. I will of course not reveal Your name during my conversation with Betfred/Active Wins. But 100$ here, 150$ there 1000 another Place quickly adds up to be a substantial amount.

I expect to be paid yesterday, and still hope to see a sensible solution to this cheat!

jvtelemark

[Silizio]

Graham Hoy told me, that they have stats problems and it will be fixed soon. He said today...but looks like nothing happened today...so now is weekend, looks like we all have to wait.

@BETFRED/Activewins Please don't go the same path that bwin choosed.....

[mickyfu]

Graham Hoy told me, that they have stats problems and it will be fixed soon. He said today...but looks like nothing happened today...so now is weekend, looks like we all have to wait.

@BETFRED/Activewins Please don't go the same path that bwin choosed.....

The famous old copy and paste email we have all had for months upon months "We have stats issues, they will be fixed soon".

[Storebuilder]

I have an old account which hasn't generated any new players for a couple of years and I got the email saying they were closing the account.

When I questioned it they said I got the email by mistake and it shouldn't have been on the list of sites to be removed as I was obviously an active affiliate.

This rush to close down accounts or try and strongarm affiliates into promoting is totally against the grain of simple business ethics and I'm at a loss to understand why they do it?

Look at any sports tour - tennis, snooker, golf and for every superstar there are are 200, 400, 1000 wannabees trying to crack it.

Why not merge the account with the new one? Why not try and understand what the problem is? Why not try and work with a hard working affiliate?

Getting to the stage where you are making money is a good thing. But I never expected to be presented with all these payment problems / payment withheld / account being closed down for non activity/ Late payments / non payment /not met quota for new FTD's it's a joke.

[Storebuilder]

In my world there would be one T&C which all would be programs that wanted affiliate marketers to promote them would have to agree to. Why waste valuable energy developing individual T&C's when we all want the same thing?

This is something that the GPWA could implement - a universal T&C for all sponsors.

[IACorey]

Hi Everyone,

First off, we want to acknowledge the seriousness of this situation, and note that we are dialoguing with Active Wins to get answers to the multiple questions and concerns that have been raised in this thread.

As we are a Friday, we want to assure you all that we will continue to work through this on Monday, and bring you all an update as soon as possible after the weekend.

We appreciate you all taking the time to raise you concerns here and we take this type of affiliate feedback very seriously.

Hope you all have a nice weekend.

Cheers,

[jvtelemark]

There are some rather simple things to do in order to fix this situation. Most of them starts with a dialogue instead of: "We are really really working hard, and we hope that this can be solved."

Basically there are two ways of solving it:

1. We are having some difficulties, and in some cases there is a slight (and up to big) chance that we have done something wrong
2. We have chosen to do this because we really dont care.

Instead youre just slowing things up by giving no admittance to anything. And just in hope that this thing might blow over. Well it doesnt, and trust me; The wind will blow much harder

You used to be so decent. On which planet are you guys working on now?

[universal4]

First of all, let's be clear that IA is not Active Wins/BetFred

IA is working toward trying to help get answers (from Active Wins) and report back, although like many others, I would prefer to get answers DIRECTLY from Active Wins/Bet Fred.

Rick
Universal4

[-Shay-]

Activewins are a sponsoring program at the silver level here at GPWA. If IACorey is not activewins in any capacity, why are they not speaking in this forum for themselves?

Corey's help is certainly appreciated but Activewins need to put on their big boy pants and come to the forum and directly address these issues. I remind everyone again :

Affiliate Complaints

Sponsor will promptly respond to any complaint forwarded by the GPWA or by a GPWA affiliate member on behalf of the affiliate or on behalf of a visitor to a website operated by the affiliate. If the complaint alleges the Sponsor Companies failed to comply with these terms the Sponsor agrees the Sponsor Companies will either provide reasonable evidence of compliance with these terms, or offer a fair resolution of the complaint.

The right of a GPWA affiliate member to lodge a complaint shall be absolute and no confidentiality or other agreement between a GPWA affiliate member, or a visitor to a website operated by a GPWA affiliate member, and any Sponsor Companies shall be construed as prohibiting the disclosure of otherwise confidential information to the GPWA or GPWA affiliate member for the purpose of lodging or otherwise substantiating such a complaint.

Sponsor Responsibility

Sponsor accepts responsibility for compliance with these terms by the Sponsor Companies. If the GPWA determines the Sponsor Companies have failed to comply with these terms, then the GPWA may publish its findings and associated background information. The GPWA may also withhold the provision of Sponsor Benefits until such time as the GPWA has determined the Sponsor is in compliance with these terms.

The above is an exerpt of the terms that Activewins agreed to follow. I also strongly suggest visiting item #3 under the GPWA Sponsor Program Code of Conduct that states

Sponsor will pay affiliates in a timely manner and in accordance with Sponsor’s published terms and conditions and will honor all of Sponsor’s written agreements with affiliates. Sponsor Companies will credit the accounts of players with bonuses and winnings in accordance with published rules and procedures and will promptly pay players any balance in their account upon their request.

I call non-compliance on ActiveWins of items 3, 4, & 5 of the GPWA Sponsor Code of Conduct.

[SWA]

I mean Betfred/Activwins pays late, but they always payed me. So this is not a problem imo. Let's wait, until Corey gets back to us all with some news.

[jvtelemark]

If you have been working with several affiliates for a longer period you know that payments are late now and again. Personally I dont like it, but its the way it is sometimes.

But the way I see it, it is far more issues than payment-problems. Closing active accounts, silence from Active Wins. I see Betfred/ActiveWins as one of the most trustworthy sites there is, and this makes this even harder. If ActiveWins Three weeks ago had said: Unfortunately we are having some "minor issues" and it could take up to 2-4 months to fix it", then I would have given them the time they needed.

If Betfred/ActiveWins wanted to use that clause of no New customers and Close the account I would have been upset, but in the end they do have that right (at least in my case) It is indeed VERY poor service to an active affiliate over many many years, but if they want it: So be it!

But then I do expect to be paid accordingly to that contract we actually are having. Here they are trying to twist their way out of a problem by Reading the contract as it suits them... AND THAT IS NOT FAIR. And it seems to me like there are a number of affiliates that actually are in the same boat.

I wish Betfred/ActiveWins the best of Luck fixing the problem as best as they can, but until they do I feel I have a duty to NOT recommend this site. And IF they fix the problem the way I want I am very sceptic to do any job for them in the future. But things sometimes changes.

[-Shay-]

I mean Betfred/Activwins pays late, but they always payed me. So this is not a problem imo. Let's wait, until Corey gets back to us all with some news.

Paying later than contractually obligated and paying less than contractually obligated IS a problem. Why should a business be able to pick and choose which part of a contract they follow and when they should follow it?

[SWA]

@-shay- yes totally agree, but we can talk here as much as we want...we all need to wait for someone who is in charge.

[IACorey]

Hey everybody,

First of all, we appreciate the feedback with regards to Betfred’s terms and Conditions. I sat down with Active Wins today and got a full update of the situation.

- The March balance will be paid out in full for all affiliates who have received an e-mail from Active Wins stating that they have not sent through a real money player in the past 0-2 months. This balance will be paid in full when April payments are run. These adjustments will be applied to your April balance as a manual bonus. If you have any questions about this please do not hesitate to contact myself (corey[@]Incomeaccess[.]com or the Active Wins team (hi[@]activewins[.]com)

Active Wins have also assured me that they are more than happy to work with affiliates who have been placed on the inactive list and that being placed on the inactive list does not mean that you will not be allowed back into the program. If you are on the list please contact your affiliate manager or hi[@]activewins[.]com.

Finally, as I have read many questions about payments not being paid on time I want to point to Betfred’s terms and conditions Clause 6.7 states that payments will be made within 30 calendar days after the end of the payment period.

“6.7 Subject to clause 6.6, at the end of a calendar month, the Revenue Share (or CPA Payments if applicable) payable by Betfred to you shall be automatically raised and paid out (in accordance with clause 6.6) within 30 days of the end of the relevant calendar month. Such Revenue Share shall be paid in [either pounds sterling or US Dollars].”

These terms and conditions were last updated on the 21st of August 2013.

That being said, we have noted the feedback from the affiliate community on the need to work on getting payments out in a more timely matter, and we will continue to coordinate with Active Wins on improving this.

Thanks

[jvtelemark]

I give you credit for trying to negotiate.

I would like to say something about "normal" business procedure. I am certainly aware that pokerbusiness isnt exactly "normal". Its loaded with youngsters working on Malta and trying to be grown-ups. But in normal cases business relations sometimes comes to an end. And that normal is that when a deal is closed all remaining debts are paid and THEN things are changing.

But nooo, in pokerbusiness you dont have to pay your bills for as longer or shorter period of time, and if you decide to cancel the deal you can skip any payments that should have been paid.

Any normal business would have paid me 640$ and 0-10% revenue from May-payment. In order to come to a DECENT solution I offered you to get fully paid in March (which I am actually entitled for) and NOTHING for April and NOTHING for May and the future. My revenue for March was much higher than normal, so thats why I am fighting a bit extra for it. You cant blame me, we work in a Money-industry. If the amounts would have been the opposite I probably would have been fighting a lot more for April-cash. But in your bogus-contract I could have been forced to settle with 10%.

My suggestion is to give both 3 and 6 a full compensation, plus 10% percent for April. This is the right move. I know it, you know it, and I reckon the whole GPWA community knows it. There is InFact NO difference between the two customers Group. What matters is the day that you chose to terminate the contract. Nothing else matters!!!

[SWA]

@corey You said 1 new depositing customers every 2 months? So this is the minimum player rule?