In my opinion 32red has threatened my domain, to the best of my recollection..

[Mark@32Red]

He had gaming content (Sega) and adjusted with the marketplace and now still does gaming.

No offence intended, but I think that's a play on the term 'Gaming' - let's call casino play 'Gambling' and see if that argument still holds up.

To continue the fruit theme, we need, in my opinion, to compare apples with apples.

32x, hopefully this public debate is acceptable, I will gladly stop posting if you believe it will affect anything.

Mark

[32x]

Hi Rick,

I said I was bowing out, but just in case this changes your opinion, which I appreciate, the site didn't have any gaming content (from what I can see, please correct me if I am wrong) until after 32Red cemented it's position in the market place.

Again, my opinion, but if I owned the domain 'www.apples.com' which showcased the beautiful world of apples (the Golden Delicious taking top place of course) and then waited for a huge electronics provider to use a similar name and changed my content to provide MP3 players, tablets and multimedia phones - I think a certain Mr Jobs might have an issue with that. I personally think he'd be justified to do so.

Regards,
Mark

Read the William Hill case, as I have. He lost because a ruling stated that he intentionally duplicated content, as well as name. My domain has nothing to do with 32red. Also 32red.com was purchased in Oct 2010 and 32red.co.uk was purchased in Oct 2001, but why wait to get 32red.com. There are a lot of issues. But again, you are making statements without doing homework.. By the way, in the USA and most countries you can't copyright a word that predates patents and copyrights and that includes numbers. The reason being that numbers and words in our language go back 100s of years in some cases. The UK was the only trade mark that 32red got for the number 32, all ofthers were for "32red" as a word. That also includes the US trade mark# 78,654,867. Again, back-up your statements with patent information and case history. It's not a matter of "disagreeing".

[universal4]

No I think debates such as this are healthy as long as they stat respectful....

Playing semantics with words will NOT win your friends in the Gaming or Gambling Affiliate sector....not when it is used to take domains away from hard working affiliates or other property owners.

Online Gaming and Online Gambling are terms thousands of sites around the world use for keyword searching to their sites and often sites will be optomized for these terms and they are interchanged regularly and inmyopinon this just solidifes the 32x owners position.

Rick
Universal4

[32x]

No offence intended, but I think that's a play on the term 'Gaming' - let's call casino play 'Gambling' and see if that argument still holds up.

To continue the fruit theme, we need, in my opinion, to compare apples with apples.

32x, hopefully this public debate is acceptable, I will gladly stop posting if you believe it will affect anything.

Mark

It will not effect anything regarding my position. I am not representing a major corporation on a public forum that is admissible in a US court of law, without legal permission. I doubt that your lawyers would appreciate a court stenographer reading back your "nipple conversation"

[32x]

No I think debates such as this are healthy as long as they stat respectful....

Playing semantics with words will NOT win your friends in the Gaming or Gambling Affiliate sector....not when it is used to take domains away from hard working affiliates or other property owners.

Online Gaming and Online Gambling are terms thousands of sites around the world use for keyword searching to their sites and often sites will be optomized for these terms and they are interchanged regularly and inmyopinon this just solidifes the 32x owners position.

Rick
Universal4

I agree. Thank you for the intelligent perspective..

[Mark@32Red]

Also 32red.com was purchased in Oct 2010 and 32red.co.uk was purchased in Oct 2001, but why wait to get 32red.com.

Just a quick reply, apologies if it was a typo, but 32red.com was also purchased in 2001.

Http://www.Who.is/http://www.32red.com

Just to keep the facts straight.

I can't comment on legals such as trademarks etc, as that isn't my area of expertise. This is my opinion remember.

Cheers
Mark

[Mark@32Red]

I doubt that your lawyers would appreciate a court stenographer reading back your "nipple conversation"

For the first time in this thread, I completely agree with you. Thanks.

Might create a smile in court though. I wasn't lying when I said it's not a great sight.

Mark

[thebookiesoffers]

I’d love to hear a genuine argument as to why ANY other casino would choose this particular number?

1 in 36 chance mate, you should know that

[freebetking]

If everybody does not get behind 32x on this, it could create a dangerous precedent.....in a few months another casino may emerge and take offence to your domain, that you have worked hard on for a long period of time and spent good money promoting. What happens then, you just give it them.....stand together and fight the power!!!!

[32x]

Just a quick reply, apologies if it was a typo, but 32red.com was also purchased in 2001.

Http://www.Who.is/http://www.32red.com

Just to keep the facts straight.

I can't comment on legals such as trademarks etc, as that isn't my area of expertise. This is my opinion remember.

Cheers
Mark

He's right. Here is the link I was using http://www.seologs.com/dns/domain-check.html
It show the domain as 9 months old.. It's obviously wrong. My apologies.. But domains are not your area of expertise. Soon 32red's lawyers will file in Federal Court, then serve me, then request 32x.com's records from Network Solutions and ICANN as per "full disclosure laws", and then you will know what your pretending to know. Right know, you know nothing. Your a rep and probably a good one, but your lawyer doesn't even know until there is a case against me.

It's not personal, but it is about ever person in this forum and you are not a small business trying to survive.. I have respect for every Casino in this forum as well as CAP. I didn't realize until now, how much support they give us and how much they do for affiliates. They work extremely hard to keep us happy. I get e-mails all of the time, asking if I need their help and assistance with any and all problems. It usually feels like a great team. this is the first time I have seen this type of corruption, and again this is my opinion.

[Mark@32Red]

This is the first time I have seen this type of corruption, and again this is my opinion.

Hi 32x,

Regardless of whether it's your opinion, corruption is quite a strong term in the UK, and an allegation such as that may well be taken seriously. It may mean something different in the US and if so apologies, otherwise I hope you think it right to revoke the comment.

My final word on the matter.

Cheers
Mark

[Webzcas]

If everybody does not get behind 32x on this, it could create a dangerous precedent.....in a few months another casino may emerge and take offence to your domain, that you have worked hard on for a long period of time and spent good money promoting. What happens then, you just give it them.....stand together and fight the power!!!!

How come?

I can't see how it would set a dangerous precedent. To me, the site 32x has been promoting casinos or acting as a white label casino for some 5 years. If I registered the domain 32y.com if it were available and used it to promote a white label or to act as a gambling affiliate site, I would expect 32Red to come after me as well.

The only affiliates that have to worry, are those who are purposefully infringing on the name of another brand to try and get type in traffic or rank for similar terms in the serps.

Also knowing Ed as I do ( He was my Managing Director when I started out at Ladbrokes ) he would not take action such as this unless:

1) He believes the domain infringes on his brand, which I am afraid I agree with him.
2) He has a very good chance of winning.

He certainly is not and neither are 32Red bullies as some have alleged in this thread. In fact the 32Red team were superb to me when I struck out as a full time affiliate in 2005, offering me a lot of advice and help.

[RyanTheRave]

I think this needs to be looked at in depth and people need to get their facts right.

[32x]

Hi 32x,

Regardless of whether it's your opinion, corruption is quite a strong term in the UK, and an allegation such as that may well be taken seriously. It may mean something different in the US and if so apologies, otherwise I hope you think it right to revoke the comment.

My final word on the matter.

Cheers
Mark

Have you even talked to 32reds lawyer? Opinion is the key word here, not regardless. It is my opinion only. Also, GPWA and CAP are in the USA, to the best of my recollection. As far as my opinion goes, we are posting comments on an American site, hosted and targeted in the US. I am not making statements in a UK forum. US laws apply here, again just my opinion.

[32x]

I think this needs to be looked at in depth and people need to get their facts right.

This is exactly right. We are not lawyers and all statements here are opinions..

Thanks

[Puma]

OMG who cares ! Its a site nobody has heard of and if people want to find 32red they will.

[Dominique]

Hi All,

Apologies for the delayed response. As I am not directly involved in this particular issue, I thought best to not get involved, but as this thread (and that over at CAP) has stirred up a healthy debate, I wanted to add my thoughts. Please note that some points are in response to comments on both forums, but as this thread was started first – I chose to reply here.

Just to clarify, although a long term employee at 32Red, these are my personal views and not necessarily those of 32Red (or our lawyers for that matter!)

One thing to tidy up first of all, in 2005, 32Red floated on the London Stock Exchange with a valuation of around £75m. That’s about $125m and is hardly small as was suggested in one earlier post. I also think it is totally wrong to suggest that we are somehow damaging the industry as we are rightfully acclaimed for the excellent service we provide for our players. I believe this is good for all our affiliate partners too.

Onto the subject at hand. Of course we have no rights to ‘big red chewing gum’, we wouldn’t have any rights to ’32 chewing gum’ either! However, when it comes to online casino, then we do have certain intellectual property rights in both "32" and "32Red". Bottom line is that if 32x.com was doing what is was apparently created for and not for anything to do with our business then it might be different. But, as it is now a promoter of an online casino, then I believe we have a problem. The OP has already suggested he was aware of 32Red when he decided to change his content, the fact he chose to promote a casino,in my opinion, is no coincidence.

With regard to the date that the domain was registered, IMO it’s not relevant that the domain was registered beforehand. What was it being used for? Not for an online casino I believe. In fact, the OP has suggested he registered the domain due to an association with Sega!

In closing, I am personally surprised that there are some members that do not see that an online casino with 32 in its title is very likely to be confused with us and in turn derive benefit from our good name….? I’d love to hear a genuine argument as to why ANY other casino would choose this particular number?

Just my 2p worth.

Mark

If this was an aff site and not a white label, would you be stepping in?

[32x]

OMG who cares ! Its a site nobody has heard of and if people want to find 32red they will.

Common-sense rears it's head! Thank you.. lol

[GFPC]

Very interesting thread so far. I cant wait to hear the outcome from all this, if anything court wise happens. It will certainly be a learning experience for me which I appreciate.

I have no opinions on this right now since I really lack knowledge in there areas, but its of my opinion (if it were me) I would want 32 red to file a claim.

Considering you have no assets and live in a small apartment (appearing to be a struggling affiliate - no offense) this can actually possibly help you.

Media alone and possibly a counter claim on your part could prove worthy financially.

If it were me I would beg them to file a claim - I do not see it as hurting you in the slightest bit but rather may help you.

Best of luck to both parties though - I look forward to the outcome.

[32x]

Very interesting thread so far. I cant wait to hear the outcome from all this, if anything court wise happens. It will certainly be a learning experience for me which I appreciate.

I have no opinions on this right now since I really lack knowledge in there areas, but its of my opinion (if it were me) I would want 32 red to file a claim.

Considering you have no assets and live in a small apartment (appearing to be a struggling affiliate - no offense) this can actually possibly help you.

Media alone and possibly a counter claim on your part could prove worthy financially.

If it were me I would beg them to file a claim - I do not see it as hurting you in the slightest bit but rather may help you.

Best of luck to both parties though - I look forward to the outcome.

* * * * The statements below are my opinions only, and are to the best of my recollection * * * *


That is exactly my position. It's no longer a matter of winning, for me. I just may loose, but I will hand-over nothing. I am also curious as to know, why they haven't Replied on CAP. It is my opinion that they will not. If they did, in my opinion, it would isolate and solidify the situation as it has done here..

Thanks again to all for your support, and also to those who have upheld the opposition. It has an interesting topic for debate and opinion.


* * * * The statements above are my opinions only, and are to the best of my recollection * * * *