Oh My. Rivals

[universal4]

Unless otherwise stated, 1 credit wagered in a game counts as 1 credit toward playthrough requirements. Play at the following games, and any variants, does not count towards playthrough requirements and winnings may be considered null and void: Roulette, Blackjack, Sicbo, RedDog, Baccarat, PaiGow, Slots, War, ThreeCard, LetItRide, Videopoker, Craps, DoubleUp, CaribStud.

Mojo where did you get that?

And looking at that list....have I already fallen asleep....what games are left?

Rick
Universal4

[JSM_Jason]

100X playthrough (good luck)

btw what happened to Cocoa Casino?

xhttp://www.cocoacasino.com

Hey Slotplayer ..I'm not on here too much as our affiliate manager Jaxon is more active on the boards now but I was just checking out the post and came across this.

To answer your question, CC is doing great! As one of the first and best Rival casinos (I might be biased ..but I think if you ask around our players will say the same!), things have never been better. We're actually getting close to a complete site then subsequent lobby update as a matter of fact. Keep an eye out for it. I think players and affiliates alike are going to like the changes

Jason

[slotplayer]

Hey Slotplayer ..I'm not on here too much as our affiliate manager Jaxon is more active on the boards now but I was just checking out the post and came across this.

To answer your question, CC is doing great! As one of the first and best Rival casinos (I might be biased ..but I think if you ask around our players will say the same!), things have never been better. We're actually getting close to a complete site then subsequent lobby update as a matter of fact. Keep an eye out for it. I think players and affiliates alike are going to like the changes

Jason

Hi Jason,

I should have been more precise. when I made my post the cc site was acting weird, displaying a Paradise8 landing page but without any of the formatting and images. Today the cc landing page is back so maybe I caught it when you guys were working on it?

Actually my all time top player from all programs plays at Cocoa Casino.

[mojo]

As one of the first and best Rival casinos (I might be biased ..but I think if you ask around our players will say the same!),

I can agree with that. From my experience, Cocoa's payouts are super fast and the bonuses are fair.

[JSM_Jason]

Hi Jason,

I should have been more precise. when I made my post the cc site was acting weird, displaying a Paradise8 landing page but without any of the formatting and images. Today the cc landing page is back so maybe I caught it when you guys were working on it?

Actually my all time top player from all programs plays at Cocoa Casino.

Ohh ok, my bad! In that case thanks for the heads up.

It's very possible that my partner was updating something on the site that day ya. If you ever notice something like that again please let me know. Just email me at jason@thejetsetlife.com. There's always that chance that an update causes some unusual things to happen and it's good to know right away so we can fix them asap.

Thanks again,

Jason

[SuperiorShare]

Hi Everybody,

Here’s our take on the matter.

There are 3 main topics discussed on this thread:

1. Withdrawal/Deposit limits
2. Wave of banned/suspended accounts
3. Rival policies vs Operator policies

Here’s how Superior stands on these issues.

1.

There are limits for deposits coming from new players to avoid fraudulent activity. However, even if there is a $2,000 limit per day for new players, if a big player comes along we make sure s/he looks legit so we can raise those limits immediately. If the player looks suspicious, we will keep those limits as a chargeback may be expected and this will ride negatively on both the casino and affiliate’s stats.

Withdrawal limits START at $2,000 a day and $4,000 a week for Superior but we will upgrade that for our top players to $4,000 a day and $10,000 a week. I believe we are the only Rival property doing this at this time.

2.

Mojo is correct in pointing out that the Canadian banning was the reason for the big wave of suspended and banned accounts. Other reasons include chargeback accounts and player accounts closely linked to fraudulent or suspicious players.

3.

Our team is taking serious steps to handle issues in an independent and unique manner. There are certain Rival protocols we must follow, but when possible, we are doing what we can to manage our own operation for the better of all of us.

For example, we have just come into agreement with Rival to manage our own bonus abuser screening. Normally, Rival keeps an eye on the network’s security. But we don’t want to shun away a player just because s/he wins a few times. We've agreed with Rival to have open communication with their Security Dept, so they can give us updates and recommendations based upon player's behavior within Rival's system, but finally leaving us with the decision-making. We’ve develop a system in which we don’t altogether deny promotions but fine-tune promotions for players that present a bonus abuser pattern. Fortunately, it has been working in some cases and players that were originally considered Bonus abusers by Rival have turned out into a positive account for the casino and the affiliate.


We look forward to hear any inquiries regarding any of the points explained above.

With best regards,

[JSM_Jaxon]

Hi Everybody,

Here’s our take on the matter.

There are 3 main topics discussed on this thread:

1. Withdrawal/Deposit limits
2. Wave of banned/suspended accounts
3. Rival policies vs Operator policies

Here’s how Superior stands on these issues.

1.

There are limits for deposits coming from new players to avoid fraudulent activity. However, even if there is a $2,000 limit per day for new players, if a big player comes along we make sure s/he looks legit so we can raise those limits immediately. If the player looks suspicious, we will keep those limits as a chargeback may be expected and this will ride negatively on both the casino and affiliate’s stats.

Withdrawal limits START at $2,000 a day and $4,000 a week for Superior but we will upgrade that for our top players to $4,000 a day and $10,000 a week. I believe we are the only Rival property doing this at this time.

Hey everybody,

I can't speak on behalf of all Rivals, but I do know that Paradise 8 and Cocoa Casino also have the same withdrawal limits, including the increased limits for top VIP's. I would assume that most casinos, not just Rivals would do this for their top players and I'd be very surprised if most of the other Rival's don't also offer this even though it's not mentioned in their terms and conditions.

Regards,

Jaxon

[mojo]

Originally Posted by SuperiorShare
For example, we have just come into agreement with Rival to manage our own bonus abuser screening. Normally, Rival keeps an eye on the network’s security. But we don’t want to shun away a player just because s/he wins a few times. We've agreed with Rival to have open communication with their Security Dept, so they can give us updates and recommendations based upon player's behavior within Rival's system, but finally leaving us with the decision-making. We’ve develop a system in which we don’t altogether deny promotions but fine-tune promotions for players that present a bonus abuser pattern. Fortunately, it has been working in some cases and players that were originally considered Bonus abusers by Rival have turned out into a positive account for the casino and the affiliate.

Thanks for coming in Paul!

I think we are getting to the crux of the matter here. It seemed from players comments that their casino bonus priviledges and log in attempts were generalized accross the board for Rivals. They felt punished for winning etc. Some were branded bonus abusers and locked out who are otherwise good players.

Part of it might be the large amount of Rivals launches in a reletively short time period. Most had free offers. Naturally players took advantage of these and perhaps went from Rival to Rival to see which one they liked best. Then once they started depositing and collecting bonuses from different Rivals, the bonus abuse kicked in.

I know there is a rule at Rivals that you cannot claim a bonus if you have already claimed one in the last 30 minutes at any Rival. Therefore, it leads me to believe that Rival looks at the players entire play throughout the Rival network.

What you are speaking of Paul is the individual casinos taking more control and looking after their own players which I wholeheartedly agree. Many players have discussed on forums which Rivals they like best and needed a little time to settle in.

We've agreed with Rival to have open communication with their Security Dept, so they can give us updates and recommendations based upon player's behavior within Rival's system, but finally leaving us with the decision-making.

I think I am more likely to want to work with Rivals who are taking the initiative to do this. You will know your players best and are more in tune with player retention.

One thing about the withdrawals, mine were set at 500 at a time (at the cash out banking screen) so if I want to withdraw 2000 I would have to do it 4 times. Why is this?

Thanks again to the Rival Reps who have taken the time to work with our concerns here!

[JSM_Jaxon]

One thing about the withdrawals, mine were set at 500 at a time (at the cash out banking screen) so if I want to withdraw 2000 I would have to do it 4 times. Why is this?

Thanks again to the Rival Reps who have taken the time to work with our concerns here!

Hey Mojo,

By default, the withdrawal limits at Paradise 8 and Cocoa Casino are set at 2k/day and 4k/week, with a limit of 1k/transaction. These amounts can change depending on a players class and standing with our casinos; such as multiple accounts, high risk, VIP etc etc.

For more information on your account at Cococa, please email me at jaxon@thejetsetlife.com.

Jaxon

[mojo]

Hey Mojo,

By default, the withdrawal limits at Paradise 8 and Cocoa Casino are set at 2k/day and 4k/week, with a limit of 1k/transaction. These amounts can change depending on a players class and standing with our casinos; such as multiple accounts, high risk, VIP etc etc.

For more information on your account at Cococa, please email me at jaxon@thejetsetlife.com.

Jaxon

Thanks Jaxon. I have some questions about this maybe you can help.

Although my limit at the cashier was 500 I could still cash out 2000, but I would have to do 500x4 to cash out the whole amount. This was not at Cocoa BTW.

It's not really about me. In other words, the player goes to the cashier to cash out say 1000. He has to do 500 two times. A complaint often heard from players is that they don't like to 'jump through hoops' to cash out. Why not just let him withdraw the 1000? Why are there limits at all? If a player wants the money out of their account to be processed by banking I believe they should be allowed to withdraw whatever amount the wish. If banking will pay them 4k a week thats fine but players feel they are being coaxed into playing it back because they are unable to send it to banking for processing. Would it be better to accept even a 10k withdrawel and then pay as per the terms through banking.

This is just some feedback I have heard. Because these limits are set by default, what is the best way to explain this to the player?

[bb1web]

I don't know but I do know its a whopper of a good question.


also agree ... I'd like to thank AMs for appearing and replies

[JSM_Jaxon]

Thanks Jaxon. I have some questions about this maybe you can help.

Although my limit at the cashier was 500 I could still cash out 2000, but I would have to do 500x4 to cash out the whole amount. This was not at Cocoa BTW.

It's not really about me. In other words, the player goes to the cashier to cash out say 1000. He has to do 500 two times. A complaint often heard from players is that they don't like to 'jump through hoops' to cash out. Why not just let him withdraw the 1000? Why are there limits at all? If a player wants the money out of their account to be processed by banking I believe they should be allowed to withdraw whatever amount the wish. If banking will pay them 4k a week thats fine but players feel they are being coaxed into playing it back because they are unable to send it to banking for processing. Would it be better to accept even a 10k withdrawel and then pay as per the terms through banking.

This is just some feedback I have heard. Because these limits are set by default, what is the best way to explain this to the player?

Hey Mojo,

Sorry for taking so long to get a reply to you. From what I understand about Rival payment processing, is that players can send their winnings (any amount) to be processed for withdrawal. The requested withdrawal will be put through processing, but just not necessarily processed at the same time, but instead in increments. So although the player is receiving payments of 500 at a time, they only need to request the withdrawal once (eg: Request 3k withdrawal = 6x500 pmts).

In some cases, these limits have been broken and players have received beyond the 4k weekly amount. I know that at Cocoa, a player had won a jackpot and received 4 times the default weekly amount in a week.

I do know that Rival is working on improving their payment processing for the benefit of players, affiliates and licensees in the near future, so hopefully we won't be having any issues with this anymore.

Anyways, I hope this helps out a bit Mojo

Regards,

Jaxon

[mojo]

Hey Mojo,

Sorry for taking so long to get a reply to you. From what I understand about Rival payment processing, is that players can send their winnings (any amount) to be processed for withdrawal. The requested withdrawal will be put through processing, but just not necessarily processed at the same time, but instead in increments. So although the player is receiving payments of 500 at a time, they only need to request the withdrawal once (eg: Request 3k withdrawal = 6x500 pmts).

Regards,

Jaxon

Hi Jaxon,

Thanks for coming by again. Hope the weekend is a good one!

I appreciate you being a sounding board here and I'm not addressing Cocoa but Rival in general. I don't want you to think I'm picking on you!

Here was my experience with cash out. At the first point of cashouts there are limits. I was only able to cash out 500 at a time. That is not the actual payment but only the first step. It is very confusing. I wanted to cash out 1300 and when it only let me do 500 I had no idea why. There should never be a limit on cashing out what a player wants. If, after that, there must be limits on weekly payments, then at least let the player cash out what they want in the first place. It is to much hoop jumping.

you: it tells me i cannot cash out that amount
you: i have withdrawal limits?
Albert: How much are you trying to cashout?
you: 700
Albert: Have you tried with USD 500.00?
you: i did one for 500. i would like to do a 2nd for 700
Albert: This your current maximum cashout per transaction.
Albert: You may need to submit two withdrawals request.
Albert: One for USD 500.00 and another for USD 200.00

It may be easier to bring up some points here from CM. Nicolas is a fantastic rep that many of us know. He has been trying to help. I think as affiliates we should pass it on as well because of course players are our priority.

Paul's (SuperiorShare) statement here that he is able to have the final say in the fate of a player I think will make all the difference! Reps are the professionals in customer care and player retention. The blanket decisions made by Rival Software have gone awry.

Nicolas stated:

If there is a casino policy that needs changing, we will get it changed fast. A Rival policy, we will try to get changed but we are just a licensee, not the actual software company.

But you can help with this. Tell all you Rival Reps to request to Rival that progressives get paid in one sum. It is in all of our interest (at least all honest casinos).

I agree with Nicolas and I think it's important to reinforce the player dissatisfaction and help where we can. Progressives is one of the many issues in that thread. Trying to study this, it appears that Rival policies are the root of the problem. I could be wrong?

Player quote:

As for any kind of restriction on cash out limits the answer is very easy. If dont like it dont play at such casinos. I choose not to. If I win I want my money in full ASAP no restrictions. Why anyone would play at a casino with any king of cash out limit is truly beyond me.

Here is the link: http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...l-casinos.html

There are more threads like this but that one is a good example.

I am very encouraged that the Rival Casino Reps are taking an active role in trying to make it better for everyone and thanks for listening!

[casinobonusguy]

I have won $50,000+ more than once at a microgaming casino.I know if i was asked to accept my money $500 bux at a time I would be pissed .We send over 100 players a month to some rivals and I can't afford to keep doing that and lose a potential 'whale' Looks like a good day for some other software programs !

[Nandakishore]

I have won $50,000+ more than once at a microgaming casino.

It would be interesting to know your ROI, how much you wager to win $50,000+

[mojo]

Here is a new Rival. $10 Free. How are affiliates supposed to promote this. I usually post new Rival offers immediately. Now I think they are a risk. This does not apply to all Rivals of course. But I think that the legitimate Rival Casinos will be hurt by offers like this as well as affiliates. A 75x playthrough is unheard of. Then there was a $5 free with 100x playthrough. This is just play money. Players are insulted. There will not be much for depositers.

I would like to promote the Rival Casinos that care about players and affiliates. This is just pissing everyone off. Is there a Rival Software Rep we could talk to? This is really going south!

Get $10 FREE (no deposit necessary)
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Maximum 1 bonus per household/computer/person. Minimum deposit required to withdraw (for fraud prevention)
75x bonus playthrough ($750)
Playthrough is the amount that must be wagered (put at risk) before you may cashout.


Unless otherwise stated, 1 credit wagered in a game counts as 1 credit toward playthrough requirements. Play at the following games, and any variants, does not count towards playthrough requirements and winnings may be considered null and void: Roulette, Blackjack, RedDog, Baccarat, PaiGow, War, ThreeCard, LetItRide, Videopoker, Craps, CaribStud, Slot Progressive.
5x minimum cashout
You may only cashout amounts greater than your deposit plus 5 times the bonus. For example, if you deposit $100 and receive a $100 bonus with a 1x cashout, you may cashout any amount greater than $200. Additional deposits, reversals, bonuses or comp point redemptions do not count towards this minimum cashout restriction.


The maximum you may withdraw is 150
A maximum cashout applies. For example, if you receive a $10 bonus and the maximum cashout is 10x the bonus your maximum cashout is $100. Any balance remaining after your cashout will be removed from your account.


Any funds over the maximum cashable amount will be removed automatically on cashout.
The following games and any variants may have different table limits while this promotion is active: Roulette, Blackjack, RedDog, Baccarat, PaiGow, War, ThreeCard, LetItRide, Videopoker, Craps, CaribStud, Slot Progressive Your table limits may change while this promotion is active.
Your table limits may change while this promotion is active.


Valid from 2009-04-23 00:00:00 to 2012-04-23 23:59:59. Promotion may be expired by casino at any time.
The casino's general terms and conditions apply.

[Affcorner]

Trying to study this, it appears that Rival policies are the root of the problem. I could be wrong?

Rival is a really good software provider, and we are very happy to be working with them. On the topic of Progressive payouts, I believe there is an issue with Rival's Policy and it is something that as an operator we can't change. I know many agree that it should be changed, and I'm sure it will, whether today or tomorrow I don't know.

While most settings on the casino have a default that was placed by Rival, the operator can change most setting. I will contact our casino manager Frank to be sure that if possible given our limitations, none of our players go through unnecessary steps to cash out. And if not, we will work with Rival to have this changed.

There are decisions regarding processing that are simply restrictions connected to the legislative status of our industry. Most decisions regarding limits are designed to lower fraud and abuse, as well as provide more flexibility to certain players. And I can see how you got caught up on the wrong side of one policy or another.

This is why I love to have a wonderful place like this to facilitate communication, so that I’m constantly becoming aware of issues as they come up.

I have won $50,000+ more than once at a microgaming casino.I know if i was asked to accept my money $500 bux at a time I would be pissed .We send over 100 players a month to some rivals and I can't afford to keep doing that and lose a potential 'whale' Looks like a good day for some other software programs !

I'm sure something can be changed in the event you described (like a different payment method being selected). This is exactly why a good casino manager can be so valuable.

We understand that for both players and affiliates, the very best thing we can do is take every hassle possible out of the way. And while our industry/processing/software/licensing location provide us with certain challenges to providing the most seamless experience possible; we know we must make sure that players can enjoy an easy gaming experience. Giving payouts as fast as possible (that is if instant isn't an option) and without a hitch is just part of our goal to providing a more seamless experience.