The Affiliate Union

[GCG]

IMO it has just been a wast of time to read all those 16+ pages with lots of flaming and accusations. Shame on you all who did that

Just get the GAU online and see who wants to join in. You can not be a GPWA, "CAP" instantly ofcourse, you have to persuade members to join and post - rather not get into too much details at established portals it will only set you back miles of your goal, ensure people like your approach and perseverance and get a community going first.

Code of business ethics should be on the mainpage (rules), if someone joins neglecting these, you always have a reference point.

Good luck

[Chalkie]

I can assure everyone here that i am working very hard behind the scenes to get the dream that i and a few others had back on track!

I feel that the support shown here and elsewhere is too strong to be wasted.

Yes there were the people that did not believe, trust or like the idea, people that think that it is 1 too many, plenty that do not like the word union!

There will never be 100% support here or anywhere for any idea or discussion.

The reality that there is room for an organisation with a clear and concise set of rules and free from any sort of conspiracy issues is very very real!

There will be many hurdles along the way and many people will fight against the good that it can and will bring to a very shoddily run industry. That is an industry that is shoddy because of the operators more so than the affiliates, however, we all know that there are some very bad affiliates about too!

I am strong enough to stand the storms ahead and hope to find a few more people that can stand the heat in the kitchen, because believe me there will be plenty of heat in the kitchen in the future!

I am not of the school that feels that the present organisations are corrupt and do not refuse to work with any orgnisation in this industry!

For that reason, i hold out a hand of friendship to all organisations that are prepared to make some sort of fight against the bad in this industry.To refuse to do so would be silly!

I am, however, very certain that an organistion bereft of funding and with a completely open book is required. I also firmly believe that an organisation that represents it members and lets nothing else get in its way is needed.

[giggles7p]

Michael,

That is what I call a "Class Act Post" and thank you very much for taking the time to hopefully diffuse this explosive situation with tact and class. I personally have had a couple of issue's with some things you do or the way you do them, but you have always allowed me to voice my opinion, and we were able to discuss and post everything in an adult and mature manner, which is exactly the way it should be. Now I think Dave is a terrific person, and i love Mojo and Robin to death, and I have just become friendly with Paul and think he is also a passionate and honest person, so the basis for this Union to me, would of been a good group of people, [except maybe Peter....LOL, just kidding Greek, love ya too] But it has been throw to the curb because everyone is so passionate about this subject and industry that emotions get in the way and non trust moves in.

We all have been let down, or cheated in this industry in one way or another, so we all have issues trusting 100%, and i really beleive this is what happened here. Someone doesn't answer an email immediately when something is said about someone, so now they are avoiding you, or someone has dealings with a group that 50% of all affiliates consider rogue, but 50% don't, or have never had issues with that group, so who is wrong there? we all can have our opinions, but remember there are no "rules" in this industry for us to go by that are "law abiding", just everyone's ethics which vary across the board. So there is no wrong or right. I know other "popular" and successful affiliates that also promote GW, and have not spoken up just as there are some who still promote Grand Prive, VA, 888....and everyone one of them will say that they have had no problems with this group or that group, and who is to say they are wrong? There are no "RULES".....some may lie and say they are not promtoing, but with research like which was done to Robin, you may be surprised with what you find. Like I said at CM..."Let those without sin cast the first stone"....I know i can't.

So this started out as a very good thing and then emotions and mis trust took over, and thats only because i believe he took on this idea, and wanted it to work so badly [and still can] that he stressed himself out and become over whelmed with the thought of possible failure which was not an option, and it became to much stress. which i can understand when you really want something to work and you now feel responsible for making it work, it can become over bearing.

So hugs to everyone, please sit back , relax and don't worry, we are behind you or anyone who tries to help our business, and if it doesn't work the first time, you just try again later, no expectations, only thank yous and love.

Pat

[Dominique]

I have stayed out of this whole thing, it's been amazing enough just to watch it play out.

I just have one comment (yes, some things I have harped on for years and still do ).

A union will never work until we, the affiliates, learn to get along. I am not saying we have to agree about everything, what I am saying is that we need to respect each other. We come from all walks of life and all corners of the world, and we are never going to see the world through the same eyes.

But we can all respect each other for who we are.

Without that basic respect and willingness to work together and listen to each other - well, what we have is quite clearly depicted in this thread.

All this infighting has to stop - it renders us - well - impotent.

[pgaming]

I started the thread because it was a relevant topic to discuss in the Casino Industry Forum. As for walking away, when the thread degenerated in the early hours this morning I was safely tucked up in bed.

I say BS Web you planted it there walked away and let your groupies take over. Trying to portray us as clowns IMO is the worst. Maybe I will start my own little self interested social group. If you don't like it you don't have to be part of it. Yes it is that simple, pull my chain....

Next conference I am planning on being there in protest of rogue programs. Me and a hundred locals all parading outside demanding justice. I will film the march and plant on every media outlet I can get my hands on. Next 5000 blogs are being set up to inform blogs are dime a dozen. The rogue programs have set these standards for us we/I will make certain we follow their example.

Enough said so go tuck yourself back to sleep.

greek39

[Chalkie]

I'm not angry at Paul, Robin, Paula or Peter,

Dave

In all fairness when it comes to anger, i do think that Peter, Paula and I are the ones that should be saying that we are not angry!

We are the ones that were removed from the loop and given no choice in the closure!

We are the ones that tried to pick up the pieces and you are the one that has chosen to go ahead without us after all that was said and done!

We are hurt and to some extent embarrassed by your actions, however, we have not once called you out or attacked you!

I will ask you to do the right thing and not continue with your version of the union.

I could ask for many reasons, however, will choose the least confrontational:

You chose to close the doors, we did not, now leave us to do what we never ever gave up doing! That i believe is the right thing to do!

Your actions have weakened the support and continuation on your part will be nothing but harmfull to the whole process of building the dream that was once shared by a group of people.

Do not take this as a personal attack, it is not! It is how i feel and hope that you can see that!

You are a good man in many ways and you are and will always be in my thoughts. Peace to you and goodwill!

[pgaming]

When all this transpired I was away in Greece and have been away sine late July. I arrived home around September 4 and took 3 days to shake off the jetlag. Then I see the post regarding the AU and quickly played catch up. I saw the interest whether it is positive or negative either way a good thing. I prefer the negative stuff because it gives me a better reading on matters.

After all that has transpired why must people constantly be suckered punch in the head. The AU was non-profit, non-sponsored, and we were all willing to dedicate our time, resources, cash if need be and people have the nerve to question the integrity of the whole thing. Wow that is truly a blunder. Dave gets called out and called a few abusive names; I am called a drunk, mojo naïve, how many more shovels of Sh#t do you little butterfly social groups do you have.

In the face of all this somehow we are supposed to be united. What a joke I say to many personal agendas. Aside from that I get the feeling some are afraid of this going forward.

I’m all for it regardless of what anyone else says. Because it is apparent most like the status quo for what ever reason. So smack me upside the head and I will say thank you.

Press on and make it work. Stop debating the issue before some try and knock the wind out of your sails.

Call me a drunk and curb stomp Dave I will give you justice. Oh yeah I almost forgot just glide over my thoughts and pretend they do not exist.

greek39

[mojo]

You chose to close the doors, we did not, now leave us to do what we never ever gave up doing! That i believe is the right thing to do!

Thanks Paul. In the end we all need to be true to ourselves and what we think is the right thing to do.

The last several days has been a complete challenge to many of us. If not for the strength and passion from Paul, I am pretty certain I would have abandoned the idea by now. In fact in my mind I had a couple of times.

To do so however would weigh to heavily on me for what 'could' have been. It is a solid idea, if done properly. Obviously it has not started out well. As with anything whether online or in life we must shake ourselves off and start again if something is worth working for.

In my mind, and I think I can say Pauls too, this was never designed to work against other groups, or fragment affiliates. Instead, it is rather to enhance and highlight our strengths and work together for the good of all. In case someone is just coming in, this is not set up to be a forum.

I strongly feel that this endeavor must be done in a way that will honor affiliates in a calm and professional arena. That is accomplished by listening carefully to suggestions and ideas. I think that once we get past this initial disaster we could grow it into something we could all be proud of.

There has been much support both here and messages in our email boxes.

I am confident we can continue to realize our goals with the support needed.

[pgaming]

Again snubbed I feel as passionate about this concept as you or Paul. Not either one of you have contacted myself. Why is that? Now there’s a direct question. I too had a stake in it as well.

I really do not understand what all fuss is about? Erect the board and collectively as affiliates we can make positive changes. Leave the forum flags, personal agendas, and whatever other baggage you may carry at the door. Come as individuals only then we may be united and make positive change IMO. No corporate bullies just us as a team. No personal attacks nor suspicions just good old working together.

Again just affiliates would work. We are very good at what we do and its time do it better.



Please do not tell me we don’t have common goals. Most certainly we do! We band together taking on the injustices. We push or demand our agenda benefiting not only ourselves but also those programs that truly deserve it.

So tell me where’s the problem? 1, 2, 3 done…

But we can all respect each other for who we are.

Yes we can!



greek39

[Chalkie]

Peter, we have not ignored you, we are unsure on your position in this whole scenario.

There will never be a day when we would not speak and discuss with you our aims and your position with us!

Stop talking cryptic and converse with us directly!

[giggles7p]

Greek being ignored?

I don't think that's possible!! Lmaoooo

Where's the Redbull? I think i may be needing some!

Lets all laugh, it does wonders...

[pgaming]

Sometimes I feel snubbed and agree this may be my own fault. I would like to add I do not carry hate in my heart. I do not dislike nor not appreciate anyone but one person. People who I have met me think would know.

So lets rock on this!

greek39

[mojo]

Sometimes I feel snubbed and agree this may be my own fault. I would like to add I do not carry hate in my heart. I do not dislike nor not appreciate anyone but one person. People who I have met me think would know.

So lets rock on this!

greek39

I wrote you back Peter. I hope you received it. Never want you to feel ignored or anything like that my friend!

[casinobonusguy]

Sometimes I feel snubbed and agree this may be my own fault. I would like to add I do not carry hate in my heart. I do not dislike nor not appreciate anyone but one person. People who I have met me think would know.

So lets rock on this!

greek39

Peter is one of the sweetest people I have met and was very helpful too.I even witnessed him being nice to 888

[giggles7p]

Hahahahaha,

Good one Judy! lolllll

Yes, Greek man is sweet and hot! lolllllll

[pgaming]

Peter is one of the sweetest people I have met and was very helpful too.I even witnessed him being nice to 888

Must admit I was very impressed by the 888 team I would have thought otherwise. So lets put the bickering behind us and press forward. IMO every affiliate should be welcome no matter who you are because we will be working together with precise goals in mind.

Michael outstanding post BTW.

Mojo yes I did receive your email, thank you!

Giggles next event in Toronto I will get you out there so hang in.

Your all are truly a terrific bunch affiliates.

thank-you

greek39/

[giggles7p]

Oh i am "hanging" baby, you can count on it! LOL

Can't wait to meet you darling, i have heard wonderful things......wink, wink...loll

Pat

[thepokerkeep]

Until now, I have not taken part in this discussion for several reasons....

1. It was obvious that the announcement came too soon. Kind of like putting the cart before the horse. A union/organisation such as is being proposed here is a huge undertaking that will require major planning and tons of patience.

2. While Dave is a great asset to our industry, he does not possess the social skills necessary to head up the union.

3. I'm not convinced we need another group lobbying for our interests.

-----------------------------------------------------------

That said, now that Paul and Paula have taken on the leadership roles, I think there is potential for the AU/GAU to do some good.

The union will need to have a clear mandate/charter and a narrow focus. Spreading itself too thin will undoubtedly strain it's very limited resources beyond the breaking point.

Personally, I think it's impossible for the union to operate effectively as a non funded (or self funded), volunteer type of organisation. The demands on everyones time will simply be too heavy to sustain over the long haul.

If this group/union were to be organised with the single goal of dealing with retro-active changes to T&C's, it may work. But, to create a true union with a broad scope/mandate will require serious man hours and plenty of cash.

I suggest that Paula and Paul put their heads together and decide on a common vision/goal for this union before moving ahead. Answer the following questions (and many others), then bring your proposal back to the forums for open discussions.

What is the most important issue for the union to address?
How much time and money will we need to achieve our first objective?
Where will the money come from?
Who will do what?
What happens to the union if one of the founders drops out?
Who decides what issues the union should take on?
And in what order?
What forms of attack will the union use to achieve results?
How will the union communicate with it's members?
If the union is going to accept financial donations, who is going to be responsible for the money?
How will we know the funds are protected?
Who will decide what to spend the money on?

So many questions....

[GamTrak]

Thanks Michael!

Tempest in a teapot (in American English) or storm in a teacup (in British English) is an idiom meaning a small event that has been exaggerated out of proportion.[1]

In terms of why Anthony recommended Gamtrack, I'm sure that is because he knows she is willing to devote time and energy to working on issues affiliates care about. Personally, I would recommend Gamtrack on that basis myself and I think lots of other folks here would as well. Now I agree there was an issue with some properties she was promoting, but that was not, in my opinion, anything even remotely resembling an insurmountable issue. I view it was a tempest in a teapot.

Thank you to everyone that has spoken kindly about me and my situation and for what it's worth the contract is up very soon.

[Nandakishore]

I was going to PM Paula to express my wholehearted support for GAU, but then I thought why send a PM since there is nothing private about saying that I will do whatever I can to support this project.