Yet Again - Income Access based advertiser links don't work

[slotplayer]

Isn't it a shame when we want it to be operator incompetence?

Again, if operators would NEVER ever have a link go to a dead or 404 page, ALL TRAFFIC would be preserved for ALL Affiliates.

Rick
Universal4

Allan and Louis, you guys truly have your hands full with all the other stuff, like accuracy of the stats import and so forth, not sure what can be done to make operators understand how bad it is to just close down links like we have seen time and time and time again, but it really is getting close to the point where you might want to consider just turning that function off, or coming up with a better solution to this.

This has happened so many times, and each time IA's reputation is questioned (not that it's fair or accurate assessment) but the mud seems to get thrown each time.

Personally, I have always liked promoting groups that use IA software, but almost every time I see dead links, I replace them with a different operator when I can.

I've seen these problems years ago with Betfred maybe in 2011 or late 2010. I just assumed it was "operator incompetence" and opted to use the default home page link thinking they could not mess that one up. I always pre-tested links in an html editor prior to adding them to the site and check the cookie as well.

I'm just the opposite, I tended to avoid IA driven programs. Any programs I promote are just programs that migrated over to it like Betfred.

I'm not sure why when a client disables a campaign they're not forced to enter a default url?

[Tony]

By the way to all DublinBet Affiliates they changed again from Vueaffiliates to Igamingpartenrs and none of the links work I try login in to Igamingpartenrs without success I can still log in at Vueaffiliates and Dublinnbet is still there banners and all! But Dublinbet has a new site and the Affiliate program provider is http://www.igamingpartners.com I contact Vueaffiliates & Igamingpartenrs, they didn’t answer me DublingBet support did answer me three days ago (Hello, I am waiting for an answer and I'll let you know as soon as possible. Regards, Alex) so I need to start redirecting links to!!

[-Shay-]

By the way to all DublinBet Affiliates they changed again from Vueaffiliates to Igamingpartenrs and none of the links work I try login in to Igamingpartenrs without success I can still log in at Vueaffiliates and Dublinnbet is still there banners and all! But Dublinbet has a new site and the Affiliate program provider is http://www.igamingpartners.com I contact Vueaffiliates & Igamingpartenrs, they didn’t answer me DublingBet support did answer me three days ago (Hello, I am waiting for an answer and I'll let you know as soon as possible. Regards, Alex) so I need to start redirecting links to!!

That is complete BS that you have to redirect the links. My distinct understanding is that Income Access can redirect the links automatically and still track properly through the b-tag. If you're being told otherwise, it is a lie.

[TheGooner]

By the way to all DublinBet Affiliates they changed again from Vueaffiliates to Igamingpartenrs and none of the links work !

Tony - I think that you're mixing the two things.

Yes - you are right - their playing website points to igamingpartners as the affiliate program.
But it's just another IA skin and probably a "just" brand name change from Vue Affiliates that hasn't occured?

The link I pointed out on page four hasn't been disabled again - so I don't think this new change is active yet.
It must be just around the corner though.

---------------

That being said - I am done with DublinBet and their tinpot "playing" at affiliate programs with the IA software.

Anyone (affiliates or AMs) able to recommend a top quality Live casino for us to send traffic too?
We sent DublinBet 60K net rev in the last two years ... without really trying.

Must be :
- Two years minimum activity,
- Top quality program
- Top quality reputation.

So no 888.con type sites, no tinpot little affiliate programs that move links.

Suggestions please ?

[LiveCasinoPartners]

Hello Shay, Tony and Gooner,
(Gooner, just sent PM, please let me know if you did not receive it)...

Yes, I noticed the links for Dublinbet have stopped working about February 1st. You would think that migrating from one instance of IncomeAccess to another would be a relatively simply thing. Back when we were using IA it took almost 10 months (yes, that's right 10 months) to migrate the FairwayCasino affiliate program to our LiveCasinoPartners.com. I don't mean to call out IA on this, it's just relevant to the thread. Tht was one of the main consideration on us developing our own affiliate tracking software. It's been two years on our own software, and we can adapt much better than previously.

I sent an email to iGamingPartners.com. Let's see what they say.

I will say this though. In the past, Dublinbet affiliate program has never missed a payment. Also, they have never shaved a player (on my affiliate account, pre- livecasinopartners.com)

I hope all affiliates will continue this on their new program. (Even though 3 weeks of dead links are concerning)

[universal4]

Thanks for the additional insight from an operator's perspective Adrian.

Also good to know you had always found them honest, hopefully they can fix what is happening with the least amount of pain to affiliates.

Rick
Universal4

[-Shay-]

Hello Shay, Tony and Gooner,
(Gooner, just sent PM, please let me know if you did not receive it)...

Yes, I noticed the links for Dublinbet have stopped working about February 1st. You would think that migrating from one instance of IncomeAccess to another would be a relatively simply thing. Back when we were using IA it took almost 10 months (yes, that's right 10 months) to migrate the FairwayCasino affiliate program to our LiveCasinoPartners.com. I don't mean to call out IA on this, it's just relevant to the thread. Tht was one of the main consideration on us developing our own affiliate tracking software. It's been two years on our own software, and we can adapt much better than previously.

I sent an email to iGamingPartners.com. Let's see what they say.

I will say this though. In the past, Dublinbet affiliate program has never missed a payment. Also, they have never shaved a player (on my affiliate account, pre- livecasinopartners.com)

I hope all affiliates will continue this on their new program. (Even though 3 weeks of dead links are concerning)

Interesting insight. Thank you for sharing. Out of curiosity, what specifically caused the 10 month delay? We are working with a program right now who are preparing to make the move from their own in-house platform to IA. The claim is that all links can be (by Income Access) redirected automatically and instantly with 100% accuracy. Based on what you're saying - I'm now worried. Any elaboration is greatly appreciated.

[LiveCasinoPartners]

Hello Shay,
I'm not sure. We paid the migration tech fees up front. All of the data was accessible on their own platform. I think our account manager that was assigned to our migration was new. We were bringing in commissions for them, but I'm sure they are modest compared to larger groups. Who knows. Maybe they had limited human resources at the time. I'm not sure why. I was given apologies, but no reasons exactly why they delayed so much. (During the process I had to continue to pay the extra cost of having two brands on their system. The 10 extra months meant about an extra €15,000 on their part. I do not think they delayed because of that, but that was the economic impact of the delay.

[LiveCasinoPartners]

Interesting insight. Thank you for sharing. Out of curiosity, what specifically caused the 10 month delay? We are working with a program right now who are preparing to make the move from their own in-house platform to IA. The claim is that all links can be (by Income Access) redirected automatically and instantly with 100% accuracy. Based on what you're saying - I'm now worried. Any elaboration is greatly appreciated.

Hello Shay,
Here's an update on the Dublinbet's affiliate program. I have talked with someone close to the new program managers. I understand that the existing players tagged to affiliates are being tracked. They plan on access being given to previous affiliates shortly. (ballpark 1-3 weeks). Please keep in mind this is 2ndary source, not directly from them.

They do have a strong brand, and good affiliate base. Dublinbet has an excellent track record, and I think they will continue in the future. It would have been nice to have the affiliate program migrated parallel to the platform.

[TheGooner]

Dublinbet has an excellent track record

No - over the last three months they don't. As it's all been done in silence.

[-Shay-]

Hello Shay,
I'm not sure. We paid the migration tech fees up front. All of the data was accessible on their own platform. I think our account manager that was assigned to our migration was new. We were bringing in commissions for them, but I'm sure they are modest compared to larger groups. Who knows. Maybe they had limited human resources at the time. I'm not sure why. I was given apologies, but no reasons exactly why they delayed so much. (During the process I had to continue to pay the extra cost of having two brands on their system. The 10 extra months meant about an extra €15,000 on their part. I do not think they delayed because of that, but that was the economic impact of the delay.

Allan from Income Access talked about the migration in this thread.

[Allan_IncomeAccess]

Hi,

Thank you all for your queries and comments. Always appreciated. I realize I posted the below response on the incorrect thread, so wanted to bring it over to this thread, and also update a few areas with more recent information.


Allow us to address them as follows:

1) Disabling Links Functionality
2)Dublin Bet Links and Migration, and
3)) Migrations in general

1) Disabling Links Functionality:

As discussed earlier in this thread, we have taken your feedback on this function and are currently working on a development that will both respond to affiliates needs without removing important functionality required by operators for legal reason.

We are still aiming to have the build completed at the end of Q1, followed by a rollout, and will post an announcement once this is completed.

2) Dublin Bet:


The issue with Dublin Bets links not working was a result of the landing page on Dublin Bet no longer existing. We worked through this with both operators to restore operations as normal, and those landing page issues have since been resolved.

Dublin Bet also sent out a communication this week notifying affiliates of the migration, and the next steps, so all should be clear moving forward. If anyone has any additional questions we are more than happy to support or point you in the right direction.

3) Migrations:

With any migration, there are multiple parties involved in the project, and cannot be done in isolation nor by one party alone. It requires a coordinated effort by the brand, its technical and marketing teams, its software platform, and our teams. As mentioned before, our role is to work closely with our partners to determine a smooth transition from one system or platform to another. By that, we mean:
· Developing a project plan based on timeframes provided, outlining the required actions by all parties
· Driving the migration and coordinating all deliverables across the various parties
· Advising our partners on their communication plan to their affiliates so they include as much information as possible, before, during and after migration
· Advising on adequate notice periods for changing tracking links
· Avoiding any interruption of tracking during the change from one system to another
· Conducting the affiliate programme migration, which includes affiliates, creative and player migrations
· Ensuring that all their data is successfully migrated

Our industry is highly based on trust and transparency, and these are two key principles of our business. We have been working with affiliates and affiliate programmes for over 13 years, and this can only be achieved through trust and consistency.

With regards to LiveCasinoPartners, whilst we are disappointed that our partnership came to an end we have communication exchanges between us including from our COO and our legal dating back to February 2012, where we were asked to pause any migration. We also specifically advised that running two separate platforms would not be cost effective.

Once again, migrations are never done in isolation. We fully accept responsibilities within our control and place great effort to support our partners for successful outcomes. Decisions and actions have to be coordinated and taken by all parties involved.

We hope the above serves to clarify the various aspects and responsibilities related to programme migrations.

Once again, thank you for your comments.

As always, feel free to contact us if you have any additional queries.

Many Thanks,

Allan

[Roulette Zeitung]

So ...

My own experiences and experiences also from some people I have spoken with the last months, who have knowledge from both side of the table shows, that Income Access has a major tracking problem. For me Income Access is no longer trustworthy. The tracking doesn't work correctly, and you can call this only a stupid opinion or that earth is flat.

I will remove all Income Access programs from my website the next time, because I am not an idiot.

I have seen with my own eyes a program ready to start that switched last second from Income Access to Netrefer. Obviously not without reason.

After months of reflection I recommend Netrefer or anything else outside Income Access, but there is no doubt, that Netrefer is the best option.

In this industry so much money will be generated, but obviously it's too difficult to make every tracking system safe. If the tracking doesn't work, then the webmaster is left holding the bag, and the programs will come in trouble if incredulously webmaster are making tests and they fail.

Leopold

[Allan_IncomeAccess]

Hi Leopold,

We take our tracking very seriously, and it is reviewed and tested regularly.

In terms of what you mention in your post, we need more information to investigate your claim and troubleshoot if necessary

As for the second part of your post, can you please tell us which operator(s) you are referring to?

Thanks,
Allan

[allfreechips]

I am just placing programs form IA into my rogue list when i get an invalid link, if they don't care at all they don't deserve to exist on my network. I also started refusing all new IA programs as I refuse to babysit their back end for them.

[universal4]

AllFreeChips,

Obviously you have to make your own decisions on pulling links and the reasons behind that decision, but I did want to state that any time an operator has bad links or 404's when using IA software, in my opinion it is a lack of respect for affiliates, or just plain stupidity for them to allow the links to go bad and not the fault of IA itself.

As Allan has stated it appears they are working on a solution on fixing the bad links issue, but since the quarter is almost complete, I do hope this fix will be instituted post haste since the "problem" has been going on since IA released their first build years ago.

Rick
Universal4

Side note: I understand the actual need to disable a banner (they should be replaced with a banner that is current NAMED THE SAME - so an affiliate's site will not hang on load looking for a non-existent image) if an offer expires or a bonus changes and the operator does not want visitors expecting a bonus that is not valid etc.

BUT in order for ANY link to be disabled, this is a conscious decision and an action someone with backend access has to make so there is no excuse for not knowing if or when banners or links are disabled or changed.

Only a lack of respect or care for affiliates, as well as not caring about the lost traffic reflects making the change and not instituting a change to salvage the traffic for the affiliate.

[allfreechips]

I feel the same and that was my point. I never use off site hosted banners as 20% always seem to fail for some reason but a link should ALWAYS default back to the hompage no matter what if its removed from the affiliate back end. And if a site will allow me to send visitors to a non exsistant page with no warning I have no use for them. The last straw was a grouip I did a deal on revshare with, they sent me links to use but they did not work.. 3 days later they stated they fixed the issue with IA and its all good now, they never made it onto my network because of that, and I see contstant repeats of this with IA such as Dublin bet, I never made a profit with them but who knows if I ever got a player to them!

[slotplayer]

it seems the software is lacking basic error trapping. I find that hard to believe though.

[mojo]

1) Disabling Links Functionality:

As discussed earlier in this thread, we have taken your feedback on this function and are currently working on a development that will both respond to affiliates needs without removing important functionality required by operators for legal reason.

We are still aiming to have the build completed at the end of Q1, followed by a rollout, and will post an announcement once this is completed.


Many Thanks,

Allan

Curious if IA thought of your affiliates when contracts were drawn with legal reasons.

Now you are stuck with it and your bread and butter (affiliates) are rightly pissed off. Links are randomly disabled with no notice. Fact.

We've seen this so many times. Taking affiliates for idiots. It only leads one way. IA needs to take this very, very seriously.

IA has skated by for years now. Action should be immediate Allan. No email me, no more pm's. Declare your intentions right here.

If IA does not listen right now, it will not be pretty. This kind of thing do not just "go away". Never underestimate affiliates. JMO!!

That is my opinion. Take it or leave it. It's only going to get worse. Your legal excuse does not fly with affiliates. You should have thought of what it would do to us (affiliates) when you created IA.

IMO there will be no change in Q1 or Q2 or any Q. Let's stop the beating around the bush. The only answer now is for affiliates to NOT use IA. That is what these posts are saying.

[universal4]

Sorry but there is NO legal reason to turn off a link.

If a bonus expires and an operator wants to hide behind some legal excuse, they can have the link redirect to the home page (giving the affiliate credit) where the visitor can see the current bonus.

If there is a legal reason the visitors should not be seeing the website, TURN THE WEBSITE OFF!

In the case of geo targeting and a need to redirect a visitor due to legalities in a specific country, sending the visitor to a 404 is just plain stupid, and that visitor should go to a specifically designed page explaining why they are not getting the website.

Otherwise, the "legal excuse" does not hold water and the fact that it would even be thrown out there makes me want to ask for an entire list of when that would even be possible that anyone would even dream of saying that was the case.....with the exception of an expired bonus or some sort of special promotion that is no longer in effect, and the fallback is still sending the visitor to the home page.

Rick
Universal4