Programs NOT affiliated with EM

[casinobonusguy]

Yes pokerkeep, removing ALL, whether they are converting or not!!!

I'm waiting to hear the decision of one other, I do good with them, but if they say they decide to keep the seal, they'll be gone!!

It is not about the money, to me!!

I don't know you but i think you have gone mad .If you work with affiliate programs and treat you well why take them down .I think some of them will drop CAP -wagershare was one of them recently.But I think the message you should send is that you will continue to work with them if they do drop CAP -not drop CAP or I won't work with you!

[lots0]

I can understand some folks wanting to get back to the business of making money.

However, common sense has to be used or we will all end up like the World Economy.

It is beyond me why anyone involved in a business that entirely relies on TRUST, like ours, would want to be so quick to dismiss violations of basic ethical principals.

We NEED to air this CAP dirt out and then beat it like dirty rug, shake it out and then nail it to the wall for EVERYONE to see. That is the only way this business of ours is going to get any public respect or have anyone (outside the business) believe we are not just a bunch of crooks.

As far as I am concerned. wanting to shove all this scandal in the shadows and not try to 'fix' it is really the wrong way to proceed.

Don't we want the public to see us as a community of business people that can be trusted?

Or

Do we want the public to see us as a closed group of con men that will do ANYTHING to make money?

The real big money has yet to be made in this business. But no one will ever make it, if we continue to allow our business to be perceived by the public as being run by a bunch of crooks.

[Jinnia]

I don't know you but i think you have gone mad .If you work with affiliate programs and treat you well why take them down .I think some of them will drop CAP -wagershare was one of them recently.But I think the message you should send is that you will continue to work with them if they do drop CAP -not drop CAP or I won't work with you!

I don't know, but just maybe I'm not the one that has gone mad??

Iam not sending any message, other than I, just like anyone else, will
do as I feel like doing, period!

[Betpartners]

I can understand some folks wanting to get back to the business of making money.

However, common sense has to be used or we will all end up like the World Economy.

It is beyond me why anyone involved in a business that entirely relies on TRUST, like ours, would want to be so quick to dismiss violations of basic ethical principals.

We NEED to air this CAP dirt out and then beat it like dirty rug, shake it out and then nail it to the wall for EVERYONE to see. That is the only way this business of ours is going to get any public respect or have anyone (outside the business) believe we are not just a bunch of crooks.

As far as I am concerned. wanting to shove all this scandal in the shadows and not try to 'fix' it is really the wrong way to proceed.

Don't we want the public to see us as a community of business people that can be trusted?

Or

Do we want the public to see us as a closed group of con men that will do ANYTHING to make money?

The real big money has yet to be made in this business. But no one will ever make it, if we continue to allow our business to be perceived by the public as being run by a bunch of crooks.

Thats not the issue here that is dumbfounding people, the issue is punishing, rouging call it whatever you like people that carry the CAP seal, that is what is hard to comprehend.

Now i have already stated here that Jinnia is free to do as she wishes, i respect her right to do as she wishes, but i disagree with her decision, but i have had my say with Jinnia and we agree to disagree, so i am not going to go off on Jinnia at all.

But e to continually state lets get rid of CAP, calling them scum, they are this, they are that is old hat now, been said a thousand times over and over again, no more brownie points for saying it.

This has now developed its own momentum away from CAP and starting to drag other reputable companies in to this by association, that is wrong.

We NEED to air this CAP dirt out and then beat it like dirty rug, shake it out and then nail it to the wall for EVERYONE to see. That is the only way this business of ours is going to get any public respect or have anyone (outside the business) believe we are not just a bunch of crooks.

Guess what it has been said time and time again but do you honestly think that going after those that carry the CAP seal is the best way forward, that is madness.

And if you think anyone outside the industry or for that matter quite a few in the industry even know what CAP or GPWA is you would be mistaken, i was over at SBR and someone mentioned CAP and GPWA for another reason and the mod never even knew who they were.

If you go to a whole host of betting forums and put a thread up and asked do you know what CAP is or GPWA and most would say no, CAP and GPWA are a niche segment and not as widely known as you may think.

Now if i am correct in that and this thread is anything to go by the only people getting hurt NOW are the affiliates themselves.

As i have said CAP certainly are no longer getting hurt, just those that carry their seal

Am i the only one that sees how destructive this is?

[lots0]

Thats not the issue here that is dumbfounding people, the issue is punishing, rouging call it whatever you like people that carry the CAP seal, that is what is hard to comprehend.

I don't find it a bit hard to comprehend.

People can promote or not promote whatever casino they want for whatever reason they want. If people choose not to promote a casino that caries the CAP seal that is up to them.

What I find hard to comprehend is how hard people are trying to shove all this CAP crap into the shadows.

But e to continually state lets get rid of CAP, calling them scum, they are this, they are that is old hat now, been said a thousand times over and over again, no more brownie points for saying it.

This has now developed its own momentum away from CAP and starting to drag other reputable companies in to this by association, that is wrong.

I'm all for saying it a few thousand times more.

Why continue to state the obvious? Because some people do not understand that, this all needs to be vetted and that is the only way to get beyond all this.

Guess what it has been said time and time again but do you honestly think that going after those that carry the CAP seal is the best way forward, that is madness.

What are you on about? No one but you is talking about "going after" cap seal holders.
Casinos can choose to carry the CAP seal and webmasters can choose to promote or not to promote those casinos. It is called the Free Market...

And if you think anyone outside the industry or for that matter quite a few in the industry even know what CAP or GPWA is you would be mistaken, i was over at SBR and someone mentioned CAP and GPWA for another reason and the mod never even knew who they were.

If you go to a whole host of betting forums and put a thread up and asked do you know what CAP is or GPWA and most would say no, CAP and GPWA are a niche segment and not as widely known as you may think.

So because they are not well known outside the affiliate arena we should not talk about the problems inside this part of the business anymore?

BTW - I don't have a clue as to what SBR is... lol

Now if i am correct in that and this thread is anything to go by the only people getting hurt NOW are the affiliates themselves.

As i have said CAP certainly are no longer getting hurt, just those that carry their seal

Am i the only one that sees how destructive this is?

Oh I disagree with you, on just about every count.

Of course CAP is still being hurt by all this. I see a good number of views a day of my CAP Rogue information.

Just how is being seen as proactive in ridding our business of the 'bad' influences destructive to affiliates?
Maybe if you spell it all out for me... I'll understand.

[Betpartners]

wow someone has a fixation responding to virtually every single line

ah screw it, its saturday night, kids in bed, i am bored may as well play the game.

I don't find it a bit hard to comprehend.

People can promote or not promote whatever casino they want for whatever reason they want. If people choose not to promote a casino that caries the CAP seal that is up to them.

What I find hard to comprehend is how hard people are trying to shove all this CAP crap into the shadows.

How is it in the shadows, it is plastered all over here, its endless and based on your comments it stands no chance of being put in the shadows, i fear that in 5 years time you will be putting up CAP posts, ever heard of overkill?

I'm all for saying it a few thousand times more.

Why continue to state the obvious? Because some people do not understand that, this all needs to be vetted and that is the only way to get beyond all this..

Indeed, we are all idiots, we cannot read, and so you will need to post it thousands and thousands of times, doubt that even the GPWA will allow that to go endlessly, but you do seem committed to this campaign.

What are you on about? No one but you is talking about "going after" cap seal holders.
Casinos can choose to carry the CAP seal and webmasters can choose not to promote those casinos. It is called the Free Market....

Uh i would suggest you read the WHOLE thread and see the dialogue between Jinnia, Wagerprofits, myself and others, really it is quite obvious.

So because they are not well known outside the affiliate arena we should not talk about the problems inside this part of the business anymore?

wow, you even forgot what you wrote.

that comment of mine was in response to this

We NEED to air this CAP dirt out and then beat it like dirty rug, shake it out and then nail it to the wall for EVERYONE to see. That is the only way this business of ours is going to get any public respect or have anyone (outside the business) believe we are not just a bunch of crooks.

Your the one that said we need to air this so everyone IN and OUT the industry knows whats going on, i was just pointing out that most outside the industry dont know we exist and a ton in the industry dont, rather than being so quick to be on that attack you may want to read the context of what i wrote.

Oh I disagree with you, on just about every count.

Of course CAP is still being hurt by all this. I see a good number of views a day of my CAP Rogue information.

Just how is being seen as proactive in ridding our business of the 'bad' influences destructive to affiliates?

Indeed you do disagree and yet it reeks of disagreeing for the sake of it,

CAP still getting hurt? whats your definition of that, new programs not paying tens of thousands for their certification, i would suggest you go to CAP and see how many new programs have joined since this started, i would suggest you see how succesful their conferences are.

And if you cannot see how destructive this all is then i am nit sure me explaining it to you would serve any purpose.

[GamTrak]

wow someone has a fixation responding to virtually every single line

ah screw it, its saturday night, kids in bed, i am bored may as well play the game.

LOL He has not been around for a long time (check the profile), but came out of retirement for this fight! JMO judging by how his first few posts to me are done in an attacking manner like he does at casinomeister's forum.

[Betpartners]

LOL He has not been around for a long time (check the profile), but came out of retirement for this fight! JMO judging by how his first few posts are done in attacking manner.

Its the defining of every single comment that made me laugh, ah well i will play for a little while then move on, after midnight here and my body is closing down.

[GamTrak]

Its the defining of every single comment that made me laugh, ah well i will play for a little while then move on, after midnight here and my body is closing down.

Yea, I'm use to seeing it. It's his style to be 'above' everyone else as he knows all and is always right.

[NLP-GOD]

I have a lot of respect for Shaun. He's the only AM who had the balls to come into this thread and speak up. Even though he made it clear he's not associated with EM, he's being burned at the stake.

Shaun came in here and said: "To be honest I dont think anybody will post and why should they" (which was at least a little funny because he was the one saying nobody would chime in and went on to become the sole participant) It's an irrational post where I think the drama was being generated by the person who claims other people won't let this die. In fact, he came in here and didn't post anything but to let us all know he thought the thread was worthless. That's a way to create drama not end it in my opinion.

The thread was meant for affiliate managers who care enough to help us out a bit with some info. Why anyone thinks we would want to string up managers who help us out is beyond my understanding. Why would we string up those distancing themselves from the perceived problem? I've already been thinking about giving WagerProfits a try again, based on Shaun's statement and other factors such as being AGD certified. Other people should follow suit in supporting programs who would help us learn the truth. I'd hope that he'd treat me just like any other affiliate and try to understand my concerns as an affiliate instead of attacking them.

These kind of things should bring our group together not tear them apart.

---

Edited to add: I removed my thanks from Lots0 because I don't want to get dragged into the drama unfolding and also because I didn't read his post to closely as I had to make my way through 5 new pages of comments just to see what was going on -- I agree on the general gist of his post that says we should all get to see what curtains EMG is behind.

[Betpartners]

Shaun came in here and said: "To be honest I dont think anybody will post and why should they" (which was at least a little funny because he was the one saying nobody would chime in and went on to become the sole participant) It's an irrational post where I think the drama was being generated by the person who claims other people won't let this die. In fact, he came in here and didn't post anything but to let us all know he thought the thread was worthless. That's a way to create drama not end it in my opinion.

Thats a barbed comment if i ever saw one

Your the one that started this thread and now you want to shift the blame for it being blown all out of proportion.

Your entitled to post this thread of course you are as we are entitled to respond and it has got to a stage where it does not matter anymore what the threads intent is, people are going to comment on CAP no matter what now because opinion is so divided.

Anyone posting a CAP thread must know that, if not they are being naive.

My opinion is simple in that i think its overkill now and like i respect your right to continue to post threads that attack CAP i hope that you respect my right to say that a particular thread is overkill.

Shaun was attacked, that is clear from page one, yes he did say that this thread was not on and i agreed with him, thats where it snowballed, from the very first page.

And in the end he was right, no affiliate manager has come in here and participated and none will, to think they would is well being optimistic.

A thread like this was always going to be decisive as all CAP threads are now, why?

Because there is nothing knew in them anymore, we already know the facts.

Anyone posting a CAP thread with nothing new to add is the one making the drama because it attracts responses like mine, Shauns, yours, Jinnia and so on.

[lots0]

LOL He has not been around for a long time (check the profile), but came out of retirement for this fight! JMO judging by how his first few posts to me are done in an attacking manner like he does at casinomeister's forum.

Hmm how rude.
You irrationally accuse me of attacking you and then you personally attack me by discussing me in the third party.

and Ya I been around this business a very long time, much longer than you.

I think it is obvious who is the person doing the attacking here and who wants to start a fight.. and derail this thread.

Its the defining of every single comment that made me laugh,

Every single one huh? You exaggerate.

[Betpartners]

Hmm how rude.
You irrationally accuse me of attacking you and then you personally attack me by discussing me in the third party.

and Ya I been around this business a very long time, much longer than you.

I think it is obvious who is the person doing the attacking here and who wants to start a fight..



Every single one huh? You exaggerate.

LOL third party in a public forum

[lots0]

...Because there is nothing knew in them anymore, we already know the facts....

I don't know about you, but I sure don't know all the FACTS.
Do you really know ALL the facts about this?
Cuz if you do you should share them with all of us.

[NLP-GOD]

Thats a barbed comment if i ever saw one

You'd have to explain yourself "barbed" post for me to respond to that. The thread wasn't really setup as a discussion (which it was made into) it was a place for affiliate programs to distance themselves from EMG. (read the original post)

Anyone posting a CAP thread must know that, if not they are being naive.

I am talking about EMG. It is other people who keep saying CAP.

Shaun was attacked, that is clear from page one, yes he did say that this thread was not on and i agreed with him, thats where it snowballed, from the very first page.

I had no part of any attack. I am not responsible for everyone in this forum.

nd in the end he was right, no affiliate manager has come in here and participated and none will, to think they would is well being optimistic.

Actually Shaun made a statement about WagerProfits and I think that was very cool.

And yes, I thought it was a little funny that he became the first person to make such a post. I still have a good humor about me and hope you aren't as hopping mad as you seem in your posts. I also respect your right and Shaun's to talk about anything you want, but stand by my logic that it's not helpful or on topic to make a post in a thread of which the sole purpose is to claim that "this is a worthless thread"

I'm saying that's the stuff flame wars are started from to begin with and certainly no way to behave if you sincerely wanted the drama to end.

[Betpartners]

Nope i don't know all the facts, i have based my opinion on APCW Videos, what has been posted on here and more importantly what has not come from CAP.

I have always stated that CAP did wrong

Now if you or anyone else has NEW facts i will not call it overkill and will welcome them.

But that's the problem there are no new facts being published just the same old stuff being rehashed all the time.

I don't have a problem with new facts, just these constant threads attacking CAP all the time, just dont look right, dont smell right and dont feel right.

And the justification is what? so that some can call CAP names and so on.

heard it a thousand times now

Do you have anything new to post?

[GamTrak]

Hmm how rude.
You irrationally accuse me of attacking you and then you personally attack me by discussing me in the third party.

and Ya I been around this business a very long time, much longer than you.

I think it is obvious who is the person doing the attacking here and who wants to start a fight.. and derail this thread.



Every single one huh? You exaggerate.

Whatever. Just don't come over here and try to dictate and make demands of me. Infact don't even say anything to me and all will be just fine.

[Betpartners]

You'd have to explain yourself "barbed" post for me to respond to that. The thread wasn't really setup as a discussion (which it was made into) it was a place for affiliate programs to distance themselves from EMG. (read the original post)
I am talking about EMG. It is other people who keep saying CAP.
I had no part of any attack. I am not responsible for everyone in this forum.
Actually Shaun made a statement about WagerProfits and I think that was very cool.

And yes, I thought it was a little funny that he became the first person to make such a post. I still have a good humor about me and hope you aren't as hopping mad as you seem in your posts. I also respect your right and Shaun's to talk about anything you want, but stand by my logic that it's not helpful or on topic to make a post in a thread of which the sole purpose is to claim that "this is a worthless thread"

I'm saying that's the stuff flame wars are started from to begin with and certainly no way to behave if you sincerely wanted the drama to end.

Ok i take your response in the friendly manner it appears to have been posted though not sure about the hopping mad comment.

Your intention may well have been different to how this thread turned out, but i have to question what you expected then, there are no posts in relation to CAP/EM or whoever else is related to them that does not get side tracked now.

I am probably very guilty of that myself, i just dont like seeing something or someone constantly attacked non stop for the sake of it and thats how it looks now and in this case looked like it was Shaun being attacked.

And if i tell the truth i don't like CAP being mercifully attacked like this either, i know what they did was wrong and they have been rouged, membership has fallen, their credibility has been smashed and so on, just dont feel right anymore.

That said there is also the people screwed over by cardspike which does i suppose justify everything against them, but i dont think that Michael here at GPWA and even J Todd want to see CAP out of business, just that they change their ways and be more transparent.

But some on here want to see them dead in the water.

[lots0]

I don't have a problem with new facts, just these constant threads attacking CAP all the time, just dont look right, dont smell right and dont feel right.

As opposed to the feeling you get from CAP?

Oh BTW - you really do need to list all the facts you know about this... Just so no one goes and discusses stuff YOU already know...

[lots0]

Whatever. Just don't come over here and try to dictate and make demands of me. Infact don't even say anything to me and all will be just fine.

Ditto...

However, I am not about to stop telling every one I can about the corruption at CAP...
Because unlike betpartners, I find there are a lot of people that don't know about the rotten goings on at casinoaffiliateprograms and EM.