The Affiliate Union

[GamTrak]

That could be true Peter.

I know that I've been 'attacked' by Arykt for NO reason out of the blue (during CAP/Card spike blowup) so I can understand what JTodd is talking about.

The thing that bothered me was that until that point I had no personal contact with him nor posted his name prior to the attack. Just wanted to put that out there since we are 'trying' to put stuff behind us.

Although I cannot speak for Arykt but think he has some valid views as does Jtodd. I hope soon these differences can be but aside or resolved so we can move forward.

greek39

I just want to move on and forget the past.

[pgaming]

The dodgy programs would like nothing more than to keep us fractured like this. Good for them bad for players bad for us. I love swapping banners out every other day, love hearing about player and affiliate robbery, I love retro terms, I love it when a program runs off with the cash, I love spam email, I love having my content stolen, I love exchanging huge personal data bases, I love seeing late payments, I love seeing rogue programs at these cash cow conferences, I love Gambling Wages, I love Cpays, I love what Rome Partners has done,.... hell all is good after all.


Man if this is not something worth fighting for then we have some serious problems.

greek39

[casinojack]

The dodgy programs would like nothing more than to keep us fractured like this. .......I love it when a program runs off with the cash, .....
greek39

Not a big Bible guy, but i been thinking of this quote by Jesus a lot lately:

Luke 14:28-29

"Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Will he not first sit down and estimate the cost to see if he has enough money to complete it? For if he lays the foundation and is not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule him"

Just rings a bell to often I am afraid in this business....

[Fergie]

This thread brilliantly illustrates why, after several attempts, there has never been a successful launch of an 'affiliate union'.

Good luck with the union. I give you my sincere best wishes in this endeavor.

[arkyt]

I just want to move on and forget the past.

If you fail to recognize history you're doomed to repeat it! Some deserve forgiveness - some do not. Possibly in your eyes I am one that doesn't - so be it; sure won't hurt my feelings.

All this put things behind us - lets forget the past - lets cover that up and go on - is a technique another shack use to employ. They also liked to jump up on soap boxes, protest loudly, play the victim, and wait for their followers to come to their defense.

That tactic worked for years - "some" even stood by their side because they had something to gain personally! As soon as it become evident that there was more to gain elsewhere individuals jumped ship and proclaimed a new loyalty. Why? Surely not because of all the years of wrong doing that they had previously ignored - but because they had something to gain personally!

Yes, I have a chip on my shoulder! I choose to not recognize individuals who shared a part in that, ignoring any wrong-doings used it to their benefit, and then ran to higher ground when the crap got too deep. Maybe some still wish to see those people as leaders thats their right as individuals - I fully respect that right - I don't respect the choice.

(And of course, no affiliate batted an eyelid. Goes without saying. Will any of you, now? Of course not.)

M-O-N-E-Y.

Affiliates and players alike care only for themselves. That's why none of this will work. Frankly, I would just go on working for yourselves as now. The odd disaster aside, doesn't seem so bad.

Sad, but true ... likely, nothing is going to change; and surely not at the hands of the same individuals who have been bilking the system for years - why not? Because the only change they'd accept would be one where they could continue the bilking.

This thread brilliantly illustrates why, after several attempts, there has never been a successful launch of an 'affiliate union'.

We are all assholes - and assholes are like opinions - we all have one!

[pgaming]

I suppose so Fergie the change will never come.

Competent people resist change. Why? Because change threatens to make them less competent. And competent people like being competent. That's who they are, and sometimes that's all they've got. No wonder they're not in a hurry to rock the boat.

In the face of change, the competent are helpless. Change means a temporary or permanent threat to their competence. But among the competent, the smart ones realize that change is inevitable...

I thank you all for your input it really demonstrates the reluctance to change anything. I will proceed on my own in one form or another. I wish myself goodluck lol

greek39

[Integrity]

Arkyt wants so badly to celebrate a "victory" by having grabbed this thread by the wheel and running us off a cliff. In some ways, I guess he's done just that. Kudos. But before he pins a medal on his chest...

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If you fail to recognize history you're doomed to repeat it!

Yea yea... you keep referring to this "history" lesson of yours in vague terms, but have repeatedly ignored my requests for specifics. It's just more hot air from a worn-out windbag.

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All this put things behind us - lets forget the past - lets cover that up and go on - is a technique another shack use to employ.

Yea yea... it's all technique. Except that I have spoken in specifics and you, after being given a direct challenged, continue to toss around the same cliche' phrases and shallow sound bites which amount to nothing. Come to think of it, the word "nothing" pretty much sums up your entire tenure in this industry. But hey, at least you are consistant.

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They also liked to jump up on soap boxes, protest loudly, play the victim, and wait for their followers to come to their defense.

Yea yea... I have played the victim him. Not poor Arkyt who's been ignored by the "big boys" of the industry. Not poor Arkyt who's iGAMI never got a fair chance. Not poor Arkyt who's been posting negative information about GPWA and APCW all over the web for years at every opportunity.

Oh, and by the way, I have been doing a fairly good job of defending myself and making you look like a complete fool. Granted, it doesn't take a huge amount of skill to accomplish this.

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...ignoring any wrong-doings used it to their benefit, and then ran to higher ground when the crap got too deep.

Yea yea... this is like watching fake vomit and plastic dog poo roll off an assembly line of bad novelty items. You just keep 'em coming, but everyone knows it's all a line of poorly constructed jokes.

You have been asked and asked to show specifics... give examples... produce evidence. Nothin'. And for all your efforts to slander APCW, GPWA, and others busting their asses for this industry, the only thing you've accomplish is to make yourself look like a raving lunatic with petty motivations. You have zero credibility.

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Yes, I have a chip on my shoulder! ...nothing is going to change...at the hands of the same individuals who have been bilking the system for years... Because the only change they'd accept would be one where they could continue the bilking.

Yea yea... and it's starting to look like that chip may actually be the only thing above your shoulders. However, I am glad you wrapped up your last post with such great moral conviction because it once again shows how you regergitate the same baseless accusations over and over without substance.

In your posts, you refer time and time and time again to unethical behavior... to bilking... to bad leadership... to conflicts of interest. Yet despite my repeated requests for any factual evidence whatsoever you have come up with (big drum roll here) NOTHING. ZERO.

Now there's some history doomed to repeating itself, for ya!!! LMAO!

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And by the way, I have never run for higher ground. When the "deep crap" comes, I stay in there fighting while Arkyt is the one standing on his own perverted version of "higher ground"... throwing stones from a distance and dictating everything wrong with the people actually trying to do something. He want's to be respected as a leader so badly, yet he lacks the skill set needed. This leaves only disrupting forums with baseless accusations and spectacular stories his greatest accomplishments.

Arkyt, do you know why no one here bashes you the same way you bash us all over the web? Because you don't do anything. You haven't accomplish anything. You don't contribute anything positive. And because of this, no one takes you seriously. These are the reasons you fail, and it has nothing to do with Michael or Anthony or Andy or me. It's you.

Really, if you want to be successful, you should try writing childrens books. That way you can use that vivid imagination of yours to make up your little stories for an audience who might actually believe them.

.

[Shaun O'neill]

Talking of ethics and morals i opened this thread stop by and have a read and share yoru comments:

https://www.gpwa.org/forum/do-you-ha...ls-183432.html

Thanks

Shaun

[arkyt]

Arkyt wants so badly to celebrate a "victory" by having grabbed this thread by the wheel and running us off a cliff. In some ways, I guess he's done just that. Kudos. But before he pins a medal on his chest...

Nope - no celebrations here - not my intent at all.

You're pretty much the only one in this thread turning everything into a "personal attack" and claiming you are doing a good job of defending yourself - LMAO - defensing against what?

Is my opinion so worthwhile to you that you have to go on and on about how worthless it is? You are a riot - I guess you learned from the best of them - carry on.

[joeyl]

I can document an unpaid debt in the region of 400k going back about 8 years. Golden Palace paid 400k of players winning to an unnamed charity due to alleged Bonus abuse. No terms were broken, only the "spirit". The decision was backed up by Kahnawake.

Aff organisations don't mention much about licensing authorities for the most part. Aff organisations do heavily support firms like Ecogra, who have failed to regulate the online gaming industry, in cahoots with firms like Kahnawake.

You guys could out a rogue and shut them down tomorrow via affiliate action. The next day the rogue will get another license and open another clip joint, which will be advertised heavily by affiliates as "new".

As a player I do wonder if anything is going to be done about rogue/inept and/or unresponsive licensing jurisdictions.

If the owners of Grand Prive lost thier license to trade, and could'nt get another, then you'd be cooking.

To do that, we and many more like us, would have to agree on what is unnacceptable, or rogue even. As I said, I can document Golden Palace, yet Casinoblasters are everywhere, so we can't even agree on a fundamental, ie pay out the winners.

I don't think another aff forum will change that.

Cheers.

[Integrity]

I want everyone to notice that... once again... I asked for any evidence of Arkyt's claims that the APCW or GPWA or AGD is unethical, or that we have a conspiracy to keep iGAMI or the AU down... or that we are "bilking" the industry. And... once again... my challenge has gone unanswered because there is nothing.


Other than that, there are threads on other forums where he has slandered certain people for a long time now. People who all have one thing in common: The little bit of "status" he lacks yet so desperately wants. One doesn't have to be a genius to see what's really gone on in here. This thread is now worthless and worn out... and bores me. It's only amuzing to smack him around for a few pages, then it's just sad.


He was successfully, however, in the only thing he's ever been good at: Tearing down the work others built. I am tired of sparring with fools who spin around in circles, chasing their tail and barking "Look at me! Look at me!". It's stupid and a waste of time. Arkyt can stay and toss off another 20 pages... he has nothing else to do. Unlike him, we have the opportunity to actually accomplish things.

[Integrity]

I WAS DONE, BUT THEN JOEY MADE A GREAT POST I HAD TO REPLY TO!!!

Aff organisations don't mention much about licensing authorities for the most part. Aff organisations do heavily support firms like Ecogra, who have failed to regulate the online gaming industry, in cahoots with firms like Kahnawake.

I am so so damn happy you have posted this!

You can ask anyone I spoke to in Budapest what I have been saying about eCogra, Microgaming, and Kahnawake and they will tell you I have been on this sh#t for a while now. However, I do not believe eCogra and Kahnawake are in "cahoots". It's eCogra and Microgaming who are a bit too close for comfort.

Ecogra is a freekin' dog and pony show which many have confirmed was funded by Microgaming and 888. They have conflicts of interests, as one of their directors is also a director at 888. They have done nothing about Grand Prive because it's supposedly beyond their ability to get involved in affiliate issues, yet they show up at affiliate conferences and slap a "seal" on affiliate programs. In short, I am not a believer in eCogra.

I have tried to make it very clear that I have plans to drive a truck up their butt in the very near future... and the same goes for Microgaming for doing exactly jack sh#t to protect players from Tusk to the recent poker rooms closing. I even said earlier in this thread that operators don't care about players or webmasters unless they are made to care... and I am gonna make them care!

=================================================

You guys could out a rogue and shut them down tomorrow via affiliate action. The next day the rogue will get another license and open another clip joint... If the owners of Grand Prive lost thier license to trade, and could'nt get another, then you'd be cooking.

YES! Exactly the conversation I had with Chuck Barnet, the master license holder for Kahnawake last week! In fact, the Kahnawake have been the only organization who have shown any interest on their own when it comes to helping with Grand Prive.

However, after a long discussion (almost 2 hours) it became apparent that the only things Kahnawake can do are 1) impose fines, and 2) jerk a license. A fine won't work because if it exceeded the license fee, Grand Prive would just move to another licence provider. And if the fine was less than the license fee, it would be totally ineffective to pursued Grand Prive to change tactics. They would still profit more by paying the fine and continuing to screw affiliates.

Also, pulling a license won't work until and unless all the jurisdictions agree not to issue another one. And, as you know, if Kahnawake yanked their license today, then someone else would be happy to take their money tomorrow. The problem is that no one works together on that side of the industry either. And until the APCW (or another organization) can be taken seriously enough by these guys, we won't have much weight to convince them to work with us. The few detractors in here don't help our cause, either.

As I've said, sometimes you guys can't see everything being worked on. It takes weeks of dedication, research, phone calls, and planning to pull off. We may not be perfect, and we do make our living in online gaming, but our long term goals are the survival of the industry and affiliate marketing... no matter how some question our motivations. I know the vast majority of you understand this and support these efforts, and we thank you.

[Caruso]

Ecogra is a freekin' dog and pony show which many have confirmed was funded by Microgaming and 888. They have conflicts of interests, as one of their directors is also a director at 888. They have done nothing about Grand Prive because it's supposedly beyond their ability to get involved in affiliate issues, yet they show up at affiliate conferences and slap a "seal" on affiliate programs. In short, I am not a believer in eCogra.

I have tried to make it very clear that I have plans to drive a truck up their butt in the very near future... and the same goes for Microgaming for doing exactly jack sh#t to protect players from Tusk to the recent poker rooms closing. I even said earlier in this thread that operators don't care about players or webmasters unless they are made to care... and I am gonna make them care!

eCOGRA was a dog & pony show from day one. You've joined the party a little late, but better late than...etc. Do a video. Ask Beveridge why he masquerades his link-trading as "recommending quality portals", which happen to include his OWN portals and every manner of useless 888 pimp ****. And several other things that are best saved for another thread, including the idiotic affiliate rubber stamping while claiming affiliate disinterest.

Then talk to Microgaming about the "due diligence" they did on Tusk, that was clearly failing well before they pulled the license. Or the DD they did on Jo Remme, who was a convicted fraudster before he ran Eurolinx - or rather, used Eurolinx as a front to skim a fortune in players' deposits and wipe out many bankrolls.

Talk about THIS **** and you might win over a few more players. But you'll also **** off a lot of people you would probably otherwise avoid pissing off.

[arkyt]

I want everyone to notice that... once again... I asked for any evidence of Arkyt's claims that the APCW or GPWA or AGD is unethical

Where did I ever say that GPWA / APCW / AGD was currently doing anything unethical? If you stomp your feet enough times does that mean I said it?

All I said was that IMO not one of them represented the best interest of affiliates and you went on the offensive.

or that we have a conspiracy to keep iGAMI or the AU down

iGAMI - I put that venture to bed a long time ago - it was well known that Lou worked his tail off to see it never got a chance. At this point its old news - though true its not relevant other than being a case study!

Did APCW knowingly/intentionally suggest a questionable character join AU? From what I have seen there does seem to be a case for that, but its not mine to pursue - AU can do that if they wish to do so!

...or that we are "bilking" the industry.

CAP (past/present) and GPWA are known for being money machines for their owner/operators NOT for representing affiliates best interest!

While this particular poster seems to want to make this personal and jab jab jab, I'm not going to be baited into making this personal - least not here!

As I said I know a lot of people already see the truth knowingly ignore it, but if anyone doesn't see the bigger picture - I'm willing to give you my view and send you some information which might make the picture a little clearer. Just contact me at ecashcows@yahoo.com ...

[Integrity]

Talk about THIS **** and you might win over a few more players. But you'll also **** off a lot of people you would probably otherwise avoid pissing off.

I really don't care who I **** off at this point. Right is right and wrong is wrong no matter what your title, position, or sallary.

The APCW has always been somewhat of a learning experience. We started as one think and have had to change as the industry keeps changing. Along the way there have been bumps, and people are critical of our tactics, but damnit we are sincere get things accomplished. Some may not like us or agree with those tactics, but we always try our very best to do right by the players & webmasters. You may think we came to the party late, but we've just been dancing on opposite ends of the room and met in the middle.

As for any other "issues" in here, people can believe whatever they want. If they want to think that there was a deliberate attempt by the APCW to take down the AU by simply recommending a member of this forum who has been outspoker, proactive, and otherwise well respected then we can't stop that. But, it won't change our dedication or direction.

[GamTrak]

Did APCW knowingly/intentionally suggest a questionable character join AU? From what I have seen there does seem to be a case for that, but its not mine to pursue - AU can do that if they wish to do so!

It appears that you would be refering to me in that statement and it's amazing how some can believe ANYTHING if they want to. Nevermind that there is no evidence to support the thought. Just more lies and BS.

Funny YOU, of all people, should NOT assume things about folks with 'questionable' character. Being that it happend to YOU a few years ago when YOU were trying to build a 'union' it's hard to understand why you want to beat others down when you were asking for support!

iGAMI Advisory Board votes to place 888/Casino On Net on probation

[casinojack]

Based on threads in other forums, seems I was involved also, Casinojack is not my real name (shocking I know, so no my mother was not a ***** and my dad a sailor and they thought would be funny to name a kid that), and I had poor taste by choosing my name as the URL is a porn site.

One day, we can talk about making money.....Nah that is not fun...

EDIT: Almost forgot, I am a blackhatter!

[vinism]

The personal wars in this thread stop now. If you want to discuss the Affiliate Union here, please do in a respectful and civil manner. Other matters should be handled elsewhere.

[GCG]

Ladies and Gentlemen or should I say naughty boys and girls in a kindergarden ?

Please go on with AU/GAU - build something - whatever if does not fit for all now at least we have something different instead of posting continiously your likes and dislikes at a "competitor site" that has been running for years.

I think this is the worst thing you can do is keep asking others on forums how to do it - just do it - whoever wants to wear the helmet.

If you keep on adding non productive information here why not close this thread and post actions or whatever is needed on the AU forum and make your own rules, instead of being afraid what the next person will say.

Create it and debate it at your own place I would say. Let's see who wants to hop over and join the AU.

Ok ?

[mojo]

If you keep on adding non productive information here why not close this thread and post actions or whatever is needed on the AU forum and make your own rules, instead of being afraid what the next person will say.

Create it and debate it at your own place I would say. Let's see who wants to hop over and join the AU.

Ok ?

I just want to add for the record that the AU/GAU is not a forum nor was it ever intended to be. I think there is a large misconception on that. I can see where folks would think that it would be based in a forum venue however, since the discussion on it was premature.

It is/was a website for affiliates only.